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The Neverending Story (The New Christian Chronicles)
Southern Baptists ending talks with Catholic Church ^ | 3/24/01 | AP

Posted on 10/15/2001 6:54:40 AM PDT by malakhi

The Neverending Story
An ongoing debate on Scripture, Tradition, History and Interpretation.


Statesmen may plan and speculate for liberty, but it is religion and morality alone which can establish the principles upon which freedom can securely stand. The only foundation of a free constitution is pure virtue. - John Adams


Thread 162
TNS Archives


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Miscellaneous
KEYWORDS: christianlist; michaeldobbs
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To: Steven; SoothingDave
Rams
1,021 posted on 10/18/2001 11:06:00 AM PDT by the808bass
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To: the808bass
Rams

Didn't they get slaughtered on Mt Morai?

SD

1,022 posted on 10/18/2001 11:08:22 AM PDT by SoothingDave
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To: the808bass
I got a couple leads. Nothin more, nothin less.

I'll keep praying for the right opportunity to come along for you. What was the reason you moved to St. Louis? (Can a Protestant call it that? Should we just call it "Louis"? ;o)

1,023 posted on 10/18/2001 11:08:26 AM PDT by malakhi
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To: hopefulpilgrim; The_Reader_David
#847
Hi,pilgrim, I think the name of Polycarp was mentioned in connection wirt Ignatius . I bet The reader_David has more information about Iggy's buds .
1,024 posted on 10/18/2001 11:14:22 AM PDT by dadwags
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To: the808bass
Rams

I have Kurt Warner on my fantasy team. Is that good enough for ya?

1,025 posted on 10/18/2001 11:15:00 AM PDT by Invincibly Ignorant
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To: SoothingDave
(Concerning Ignatius, disciple of John): Given this centrality do you really expect that someone learning diretly from a disciple of the Lord would get it so wrong, so fast? Completely misunderstand?

Would GO wrong, possible. Could GO wrong, possible. Misunderstand, not likely, but possible. I do not know. Knowledge puffs up. Man is known to embellish truth, "exaggerate" the truth. ("I caught a fish thiiiiiiiiiisss big." Yeah, sure.) Already, even in Jude's days, "certain persons had crept in unnoticed" and misrepresented the grace of God. "No man is dependable" (NAB) ("All men are liars." KJV?), the psalmist said. To tell you the truth (no pun intended), I don't trust my own reasonings about God, nor do I put my entire trust in what any other human being thinks or says he knows. I know that it's possible for them to be wrong or to mislead unintentionally. I reserve judgment until I can find a "thus saith the Lord," so to speak... I guess that is why I would not make a good Catholic and why I constantly question people, and search the scriptures in private.

1,026 posted on 10/18/2001 11:21:14 AM PDT by hopefulpilgrim
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To: SoothingDave
We all at times speak to the "true" meaning of Scripture, like you above. You are sure that you know the true meaning of this passage. If you are not claiming inerrancy here, you are certainly claiming "errancy" on our part.

I do not know all there is to know about this verse, much less the whole passage, but I do know that it is addressing the SOURCE of prophecy rather than the COMPREHENSION of prophecy. I think you are just trying to make me look like I believe myself to be inerrant, when you know that I make no such claim. Shame.

1,027 posted on 10/18/2001 11:30:17 AM PDT by hopefulpilgrim
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To: Iowegian
#883
HaHaHaHa Good one. looks like something out of The Joyful Noiseletter . (BTW) they are on the www.
1,028 posted on 10/18/2001 11:34:36 AM PDT by dadwags
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To: Havoc; SoothingDave
SD wrote:

I would guess you don't know Havoc? He pontificates about the true meaning of Scripture all the time. He doesn't claim only inerrancy, he claims to speak the Word of God.

Havoc, do you believe your opinions on Scripture are without error?

1,029 posted on 10/18/2001 11:35:03 AM PDT by hopefulpilgrim
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Comment #1,030 Removed by Moderator

To: Havoc
Perhaps you haven't noticed that the Holy Apostles, inspired by the Holy Spirit, released Christians from keeping the whole of the Law. Read Acts. Quite fitting since Christ fulfilled all the Law in his Life, Death and Resurrection.

I will again ask: would you avoid buying a linen-wool blend jacket? And add: for that matter, do you make sure the meat you buy at the supermarket wasn't strangled?--that's part the Apostles kept. Do you seriously believe that a widower who stops by his wife's grave and sits a while and addresses his wife in imaginary conversation for his comfort is a necromancer? If you have mold or mildew, do you call a priest and have him scrape the wall it's on, then come back later and check, and tear down your house if it came back? Do you not eat pork or lobster?

I suspect you are not so zealous for the Old Covenant Law as you let on, and have just picked passage from it you can twist into a justification for your preconceived idea that the historic Christian practice of asking the intercessions of the saints in Christ is wrong.

1,031 posted on 10/18/2001 11:38:13 AM PDT by The_Reader_David
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To: allend
How do you know Mark didn't screw up Peter's teaching? Or Luke Paul's? How do you know the Apostles didn't screw up Jesus' teaching?

Jesus,Mark, Peter, Luke, Paul & the rest of the apostles didn't have to screw up one anothers teachings. They prophetically knew that was to come when the catholic church took over. :-)

1,032 posted on 10/18/2001 11:38:21 AM PDT by Invincibly Ignorant
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To: hopefulpilgrim
I do not know all there is to know about this verse, much less the whole passage, but I do know that it is addressing the SOURCE of prophecy rather than the COMPREHENSION of prophecy. I think you are just trying to make me look like I believe myself to be inerrant, when you know that I make no such claim. Shame.

Sorry, I disagree. I realize you are not claiming inerrancy on all matters or of all Scripture. But in the example given you are pretty darn sure that we are in error and that you are right about what it means.

So I will apologize for implying that you think you have total inerrancy over all Scripture. But as for partial inerrancy over certain parts, we all do it sometimes. Except Havoc. He doesn't even recognize the existence of separate concepts called "what Havoc thinks Scripture means" and "What Scripture actully means."

SD

1,033 posted on 10/18/2001 11:40:19 AM PDT by SoothingDave
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To: hopefulpilgrim
This is getting crazy. Look at the scriptures...God says in the following verse (20:5) that we must not WORSHIP or SERVE the images, for "the Lord your God is a jealous God." He's talking about idol worship. Don't treat them as you would God. Don't pray to them, don't bow the knee to them, etc.

I've looked at the commandment. I understand this to mean idols. An idol is anything that can be worshipped and is an object of adoration. Tell me, bud, was Aron any less guilty for creating the idol than those who bowed to it, prayed to it, danced before it, etc.. I'm very careful now about what I put to paper or shape from clay or resin. An image of a person can become an object of great adoration. It can lead one to sin in ways you might not imagine.

1,034 posted on 10/18/2001 11:41:51 AM PDT by Havoc
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To: hopefulpilgrim
Oh, try this from Havoc, post 446

Knowing God's word, I speak God's word and with authority.

SD

1,035 posted on 10/18/2001 11:42:22 AM PDT by SoothingDave
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To: Havoc
English! Oh, that's my problem, I've been reading the oldest extant versions of the Holy Scriptures, the ones in Greek. Gee, isn't it wonderful God corrected those errors when the Bible got translated into English. Fancy that He didn't mean eidolon or homoioma, he meant eikon, which are all radically distinct notions in Greek, and finally got it straightened out when it was translated into English. Gee, we're so lucky to be living now. All those supposely holy folk before the 1600's are damned because they based they're doctrines on a faulty text. /sarcasm
1,036 posted on 10/18/2001 11:44:32 AM PDT by The_Reader_David
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To: The_Reader_David
Perhaps you haven't noticed that the Holy Apostles, inspired by the Holy Spirit, released Christians from keeping the whole of the Law

Uhuh. And I'm quite aware of that. I'm also quite aware of the fact that you'll use a linen wool jacket argument based in reason as an excuse to involve oneself in holding to psychics, spirtism and witchcraft - then say you aren't in the wrong because of whatever is the convenient argument at that point. Why not just go all out, pull down the pretense and tell everyone they can worship satan and sacrifice babies - afterall, there isn't anything left in the Bible that would prevent it in God's eyes by your reason.

1,037 posted on 10/18/2001 11:46:20 AM PDT by Havoc
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To: Havoc
I'm very careful now about what I put to paper or shape from clay or resin. An image of a person can become an object of great adoration.

Not just images of people, but images of anything can be objects of great adoration.

How do you do your art? What is an acceptable subject?

SD

1,038 posted on 10/18/2001 11:46:36 AM PDT by SoothingDave
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To: hopefulpilgrim
I believe that my opinions on scripture have little to do with anything. I difer to the scriptures, and to the Lord. If you aren't doing the same, you need to ask yourself what you are doing.
1,039 posted on 10/18/2001 11:50:25 AM PDT by Havoc
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To: Havoc
You will notice that the Holy Apostle Paul does provide some moral guidance, as does Christ who condemns anger along with murder.

You still haven't answered, my question, though.

1,040 posted on 10/18/2001 11:52:30 AM PDT by The_Reader_David
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