Any Catholics wanna straighten Pelayo out? Or are ya gonna let em twist?
Bass, this is a very difficult subject because it strikes at the heart of a mystery. We profess Jesus as one person, a union of two natures, human and divine. But we can not fully grasp what this means and these types of controversies are as complicated and convoluted as the free will/determininsm ones.
What Pelayo is emphasising is the divine part of Jesus. If Jesus was God, then there is no way that God could sin, do harm. That is true.
What the others are emphasising is the human part of Jesus, especially how He serves as a role model for us. Havoc almost sounds Pelagian or Jewish in his insistance that Jesus did not "use" his divinity, but rather only his humanity. Proving that we can, by following the will of God, be sinless. If this were strictly true, then the Jews are right.
Others are also focused on the human nature of Jesus in that he faced temptation and avoided sin, he stood up to the same dangers we face every day and did the right thing. If Jesus was not human like us then the Incarnation was a "magic trick" and not real. Jesus must have been able to be really tempted AND have a free choice to sin or not. This is true.
How do we reconcile the fact that Jesus, as human, must have been able to sin with the fact that Jesus, as God, could not have possibly actually sinned? I don't know. I don't know if we can explain it.
SD
Thanks, SD! ;o)
I noticed this in Havoc's reply last night, and was wondering if anyone else would pick up on it.
Docetism may be the denial of the reality of Jesus' humanity. And I do not think Pelayo has strayed to that point. Perhaps, a truncation of Jesus' humanity is a better way of characterizing the view which seems to be expressed. If Jesus could not sin, then what was acted out on earth was a divine farce. Now, one could say that there is no possibility that Jesus would sin and that would make all the difference. But to say that He could not sin removes him from the realm of humanity (even the initial form of humanity expressed by Adam and Eve, before the fall).
Pelayo's view seems to fit under the category of Apollinarianism (the friend of Athanasius, Apollinarius) which emphasized the deity of Jesus to the effective suppression of his humanity. It was condemned at the Council of Constantinople in 381.
Adam was a man made without sin - made in God's image... Adam sinned. Jesus, through suppression of his divinity is the second Adam. Ya'll make this stuff entirely too difficult. And the Jews do have it right - minus that messiah thing. Salvation comes through the messiah. Add that and the Jews would be perfected as they already understand that they are not to sin and actively work to keep themselves from sin. This is obedience at work. Would be Christians can learn a lot from the Jews. Obedience is required for eternal life for those of you struggling to keep up..