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Look, I know that what I am about to say won't go anywhere with you. But, let me have a go at it anyway. Obviously you are a LIBERTARIAN! Fine! I am a conservative. Most of the people in this forum are conservatives. But, just for the record: most conservatives have a libertarian philosophy about government and life in general. Most of us agree with libertarians on about 90% of the issues out there and recognise that we are fighting on the same team. It isn't us getting in your face that's the problem, my friend. The problem seems to revolve around you seeing fit to announce every 10 seconds that you're not a conservative- as if to say "I'm not one of those wackos, i'm different". Well fine, who cares? I don't! In fact, the only reason that i'm taking the time to write this fantastic diatribe directed towards you is that I wouldn't want you to lay your little head down on your pillow tonight thinking that someone hadn't noticed how truly annoying you really are. So let the record show, I took notice. I responded. There is, also, a second reason I chose to respond to you: i've noticed for a while now that some of the people that you use to point out to us as "libertarians- not conservatives", aren't libertarians at all! You are either accidentally or deliberately misquoting or misreading some of the people you use as examples. You need to understand that the word "libertarian" is used in different ways. Most conservatives have said "I believe in a libertarian philosophy about government" or "i'm a libertarian because I don't believe in a nanny state, I believe in individual freedom". That use of the word means that one airs on the side of freedom with respect to government policy. That is quite different from your use of the word which describes a modern political grouping whose main goal seems to be to legalize drugs, bash religion, and excuse alot of problems in society all in the name of freedom. Your use of the word is in the second sense, or as you would put it- a fiscal conservative/social liberal. I consider myself a libertarian in the first sense, as do most conservatives. I've heard you and others use Bill Buckley as an example because he's changed his mind on the drug war. He has said quite clearly that he is a conservative. And there are dozens of other examples that you give which are wrong. But the one that always makes me laugh is when you call Tony Snow a libertarian. What plot of sand have you been burying your head in. I follow Tony Snow very closely and had the great chance to hear some lectures he gave not too long ago. So, I think I may have a little more knowledge of the subject than you: he is without a doubt a conservative. He's adamantly pro-life (in fact, when a girl asked him if there was a middle ground, he said no!). He stated on Rush sometime last July, that "people who are social conservatives, people like you and me, people who believe in traditional values, people that believe in family and god should not be afraid of being made fun of by elites in Washington and Hollywood, we should be proud. I know i'm proud". He's made clear he is very much opposed to gay marriage and gay adoption, because "it's not natural". And, I really hate to burst your bubble, but he also strongly favors the drug war and keeping drugs illegal. He appeared on "politically incorrect" with Bill Maher last April when he was making the media rounds celebrating F.N.S.'s five-year anniversary. The subject of the drug war came up and Bill, being a left-wing idiot who wants it ended, said that it was a crime against humanity the lengths that we've been willing to go to fight it. Tony Snow countered by saying that Maher was dead-wrong and that the problem is that we haven't been willing to go far enough or fight hard enough to win it. Maher got really angry and essentially called Tony an idiot. Most libertarians don't favor the drug war being fought even harder. Most libertarians, who are socially liberal, don't favor traditional values and they certainly don't speak glowingly of them everytime you hear them. Most libertarians don't state in no uncertain terms "i'm a social conservative", "Abortion should be outlawed", "marriage is a sacred institution for a man and a woman, nothing else". But, the thing that perhaps debunks your claims the most is the fact that he has already made perfectly clear that he is a conservative: I saw a lecture that he gave which was played on c- span. A girl asked a question about ideology and another about conservatism. He said that he is a conservative because he believes in lower taxes, smaller government, traditional values and because he is pro-life. Someone else asked about something having to do with libertarians and he said that he sees their points on many things but that he doesn't like their social views because he's way too socially conservative, or as he put it "on culture, they head left and I head right and never the twain shall meet- I'M A CONSERVATIVE, FOLKS!" But, aside from everything else, i'm mostly just tired of listening to self-appointed half-wits like you lecture the rest of us about freedom. I got news for you buddy- I understand far better than someone with your obvious limited mental capacity could ever dream understanding about just exactly what it means to be free- Do you know why?....... Because, i'm a CONSERVATIVE!!! So, put that in your so-called libertarian trumpet and blow on it!!!

You are right about one thing, it was quite a diatribe.

Unfortunately almost all of it is wrong.

I asked Snow how he described himself and he told me he was a libertarian. He may say different things at different times for all I know. I don't watch every show he is on but I have found his philosophy to be consistent with libertarianism and also in agreement with mine on social issues. I'm sure we disagree on some things.

You have not only misrepresented libertarianism but you accuse me personally of saying things I never said. Then you try to debunk them and set up a perfect little strawman. Nice try.

I was going to respond on a point by point basis but your diatribe is so long, so ill written and so full of hateful rage that I don't even know where to start.

Suffice it to say that you are either ignorant about libertarians or a liar. You seem fairly ignorant so I'll give you the benefit of the doubt.

Btw, it might be better if you stick to the topics, debate them, and stay away from the name calling.

Now take a few deep breaths and try not to hurt yourself. If you want to debate a point, make them one at a time after you collect yourself. I would be happy to disabuse you of your misconceptions.