I would never equate silence with surrender, I was just diappointed that I got no response. I know I can't respond to everything.
Ah, one of my favorite passages.
Mt 18:15 Moreover if thy brother shall trespass against thee, go and tell him his fault between thee and him alone: if he shall hear thee, thou hast gained thy brother. V-16. But if he will not hear thee, then take with thee one or two more, that in the mouth of two or three witnesses every word may be established.
V-17. And if he shall neglect to hear them, tell it unto the church: but if he neglect to hear the church, let him be unto thee as an heathen man and a publican.
V-18 Verily I say unto you, Whatsoever ye shall bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever ye shall loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.
V-19 Again I say unto you, That if two of you shall agree on earth as touching any thing that they shall ask, it shall be done for them of my Father which is in heaven.
As it is plain to see, it was a local problem, and it dealt with individual problems in the Church, not eternal forgiveness for salvation.
So saith the Gospel According to JHavard.
Can you tell me why, if this was an internal thing in the local church, some dispute, why didn't Jesus tell the people to search the Scriptures for the resolution to the problem? Instead He tells them to "hear the church." How preposterous. It's like Jesus thought there would be something singular known as "the church" which had the authority to settle disputes among Christians. How silly. We know the real solution if the church won't hear you is to start a new church.
By your statements, any two people who come together in the name of the Lord can forgive any sin from any person for anything at any time.
Wouldn't it be wonderful? If we all really could forgive each other like that? To freely dispense forgiveness for even the worst transgressions. It would almost make the Lord's Prayer seem like a good deal. "forgive us ...as we forgive those"
Just think, we don't even need Christ anymore, men can take care of all these small details themselves.
The power of Christ compels you. Jesus is not talking abotu us not needing Him, but rather how we can spread His forgiveness among our people. That you see anything that isn't direct "me and Jesus" as cutting Jesus out of the picture is to not understand the Community of all Believers.
How about this, you two forgive me, and we will forgive you, and between the four of us, we can wipe all sin out of our life for ever. "NOT"
How about this? Jesus actually says that if only two of us agree, anything we ask will be done by Our Father in Heaven. Isn't that amazing? Now if we could only learn to agree. That's the way it is with God. Always a catch.
SD
This is equivalent to Clinton saying,"I'm glad you asked that question" when Star asked him if he had, had sex with Monica(that woman)Lewinski.Lol
So saith the Gospel According to JHavard
well, were half way down the post, and you haven't said anything so far.
Can you tell me why, if this was an internal thing in the local church, some dispute, why didn't Jesus tell the people to search the Scriptures for the resolution to the problem? Instead He tells them to "hear the church".How preposterous. It's like Jesus thought there would be something singular known as "the church" which had the authority to settle disputes among Christians. How silly. We know the real solution if the church won't hear you is to start a new church.
In this group of words, you seem to ask and answer your own questions, as though you prefer to talk to your self, so there is nothing there for me to comment on.
Wouldn't it be wonderful? If we all really could forgive each other like that? To freely dispense forgiveness for even the worst transgressions. It would almost make the Lord's Prayer seem like a good deal. "forgive us ...as we forgive those"
SD, I’m glad to be the barer of good tidings,"we can forgive each others sins, but God is still to be reckoned with for the sin's we have sinned against him, and these are the ones that deal with eternal salvation.
As with our legal system, because the judge finds you innocent, or if you serve your time in jail, that still in no way releases you from God's laws.
The power of Christ compels you. Jesus is not talking abotu us not needing Him, but rather how we can spread His forgiveness among our people. That you see anything that isn't direct "me and Jesus" as cutting Jesus out of the picture is to not understand the Community of all Believers.
So you are saying that this account in Matthew is to show us to spread love around. That is not what this about, it is about the way the new Church should be ran, do not go running to others when some one sins against you, but try to work it out with him personally, then if that fails, go to plan B.
This is about handling Church differences between those who have God's Spirit, and all this comes after we have gone to God in repentance, and become members of his Body.
How about this? Jesus actually says that if only two of us agree, anything we ask will be done by Our Father in Heaven. Isn't that amazing? Now if we could only learn to agree. That's the way it is with God. Always a catch.
This is really enlightening coming from an organization that needs papal authority to have a size #2 bowl movement.
You tell us one thing, how God forgives each of us if we forgive everyone else, and the world will live in peace and harmony forever more, while you have to run to your priest to mediate for your sin's, and to play it safe, you fall back on Mary just in case Christ is busy, and we all know that she can walk into his office when ever she pleases. That is pure hypocrisy, to allude to how simple forgiveness of sin is, with what you RCC's have to go through to attain it.
How many doctrine and rituals do you have concerning the forgiveness of sin, than you take the high ground with us, and say, it is so simple, we don't even need Christ to do it, we can forgive each other.