[terilyn]

To address the pacifists, those that are calling for forgiveness and healing, I heard a caller this morning on The Patriot radio. I won't take credit for these words, but I thought they were very good.

I loosely quote, "The American's who are calling for peace and forgiveness, must separate forgiveness from justice. For example, if I broke into a house to commit a robbery and wound up murdering one of the residents and the two others were only injured but lived, over the course of time one or both of the survivors might forgive me. That does not supercede justice. I would still be charged with the murder and prosecuted and brought to justice for that murder, regardless if those that survived forgave me."

The anti-war crowd needs to realize that there is a difference and while we can combine forgiveness with justice, (perhaps by not blaming all Muslims for the attacks that were perpetrated by a few), the former cannot simply replace the latter.

[narby]

Racial profiling of foriegn born Arabs is the only rational response right now. 100% of the Terrorists in the planes were foriegn born Arabs. We don't want any more people killed, as they are threatening to do, so the only logical place to start is on the tiny minority of foriegn born Arabs.

Ask the liberal if it would make sense to interrogate people wholly at random, which would take forever? Or start with the most likely prospects?

[VRW Conspirator]

He argued with me today that anyone who would feel uneasy getting on a plane with a group of Arab men IS A RACIST.

I see a number of good responses.

Attacking a conservative with the "racist" label is an old liberal tactic. Know that what your friend is trying to do is not necessarily defend non-racists attitude but trying to knock you out of any arguements in the first round.

When hit with this, I revert to reminding the liberal(s) that I could not possibly be a racist because I do not like anybody and my dislike is uniform.

Then I divert the racist argument. I remind them that minorities have more abortions per capita then whites and that the limosine liberals know that and applaud it, because they perfer not to have as many minorities around-they are the true Nazis.

I am just warming up.

[dalebert]

Try "next time it will be nukes and your family"

[100%FEDUP]

Tell these peaceniks to put their money where their mouths are, empty their bank accounts and buy a ticket to Afghanistan. Use the rest of the money to buy as many flowers as they can carry. Have them fly to Afghanistan and put the flowers in the barrels of the Islamic extremists AK's while apologizing for offending them. Then we'll see how many of them make back to the good ol' U-S of A!

[magellan]

Don't let them get away with the "it's a crime, not an act of war" crap.

At least one of the pilots was a former military pilot (the Pentagon attack). The Pentagon attack was the most difficult, flying an jet aircraft at over 400 knots at treetop level. The pilot tried first to strike the white house, but was unable to line up, so he went for his secondary target (military attacks have secondary targets, criminals do not).

The Pentagon was a miltary target. The WTC was an economic target. This was a military attack.

The two planes that struck the trade center attacked from opposite directions. This is typical of how a military air attack would happen. The first was from the north, the second was from the south. The second attack coming from an initial point in central New Jersey (initial point is a miltary aviation concept), put the plane as far away from our interceptor fighters out of Massachusetts as possible. Again proving this was a planned military attack.

As appointed as commander in chief of the Taliban army, Bin Laden was not acting as an independent criminal but was functioning as the commanding general of a sovereign country's military.

Osama bin Laden declared war on the U.S. in 1996.

[Eva]

Read this post from, yesterday. It has all the argument you need.

Good Wars

[woofer]

surrounded by old friends who are well-read (NYT, WP, LAT, NPR, CNN) and educated...

I don't know if I'd call that "WELL" read. both at least they keep up with events.

[Storm Orphan]

Don't be offended, but you will stay a poor arguer if you cannot learn to form your own arguments and opinions.

[VRW Conspirator]

More on arguing with liberals.

It might help to know what you want to have accomplished upon walking away from the liberal(s). For me, I resent being "labeled" as racist. Most of the time, I want to genuinely influence the liberal(s).

I recognize the truism that to be liberal requires little thought and little effort(thank you Rush Limbaugh). When I want to influence a liberal, my goal is to get them to think for a moment. If I can do that, then I feel that I have accomplished a major victory because I know that they will quickly revert to feelings away from critical thinking.

I also like to drive a wedge between liberal politicians and the liberal rank and file. Enough for now.

[Saintt]

No person is ever obligated to take more than a prudent risk in life. That goes for investing, marriage, everything. Stayng away from mass gatherings, air travel and the like right now shows discernment. 400 people have been arrested, am I correct? Who knows how many more are still "sleepers", still lurking out there? The facts have also told us that we CANNOT tell the good guys from the bad guys right now. Listen to the interviews of those who knew the terrorists. There were all SHOCKED. You are doing what any normal person would; sizing up a situation and discerning what to do. You have every right to do that, and if "Arabian" is in your profile right now, well, why wouldn't it be? Ask you friends how they would size up the situation. Look, more people are going to die in this country before we get a handle on this. Eventually, more people will be free. That is war. In the meantime, you don't have to be one of the people who goes out of their way to tempt fate. And you don't have to defend that position. It is natural to be very discerning right now.

[prov1813man]

There really is only one rational answer. You need some new friends. When a positive meets a negative one of three things happens: the positive lifts the negative, the negative drags down the positive, or they separate. If you have idiot liberals for friends who, even after their fellow citizens were murdered, are sticking to the party line, chances are nothing will change them."you are either with us or you are with the terrorists".

[prov1813man]

Further, the fact that they read the publications you listed doesn't make them well read, it makes them well programmed. If the education you are impressed with occurred in the past two decades, they aren't educated, they are re-educated by one of the socialist training camps that were once the great American Universities.

"...by their fruits ye shall know them"

[Barnacle]

Even some of my most liberal friends are beginning to see the light as a result of this attack on our country. Remember, Pearl Harbor 1941 pales in comparison to WTC 2001. However, if challenged, I suggest you return the challenge with questions and let them turn blue in the face trying to defend their counteractions. Questions such as "Is there anything worth fighting for? Your wife, your child, would you fight to save one of them? Do you support the people who are going off to fight for your wife, your child and you? What do you think the state of our country would be if we had your attitude in W.W.II? What do you think would happen to you if expressed such an opinion in a country without free speech? Who earned your right to free speech? You? Or was it given to you as a gift? We are the defenders. The Talaban are the aggressors. Have you asked them to be peaceful? What do you think their reply would be? Do you deserve be rescued if directly threatened by terrorist activity? Who would rescue you? What would you do to rescue someone threatened? What is the difference between a patriot and a coward? Where do you lie on that line?"

[Boxsford]

It's been fun reading this thread. Thanks for starting it. So far, I've gotten half way through. What incredibly great answers you got--none that I can top or add to. They're right on and perfect! Please let us know how your weekend turns out. I especially like the 'neat little trap' suggestion. Hope you try that one out. Good luck and God bless you. Hey, wait, I can add something.....pray. Ask the Lord to give you His words to say what needs to be said. Keep us posted.

[4Liberty]

Hi there, Here's my advice: It's almost impossible to convince Liberals (egalitarians) that their policies are infantile & idiotic - unless they've first had a couple economics courses. To Liberals, "wealthy" (U.S./European/Asian) people don't deserve "protection" or "self defense." To dems, wealthy, successful citizens are "part of The Problem" -- and 'deserve' what they get, for being insensitive, overly rich, selfish and blahblahblah. If I could get them in my economics classes for two weeks, I could very quickly provide evidence convincing them that U.S. wealth isn't "the problem." -- The "problem" is an ongoing lack of productivity and the difficult harsh environments (droughts, etc.) that makes people in most 3rd world countries poor, and triggers fairly regular bouts of regional violence, crime rates and corruption - including terrorism (as a usual by-product). The "Rich" don't cause the droughts in Africa; Droughts just happen, and with a regular, horrifying frequency. They (the dems) like to cling to the class-conflict model of world problems, because that finger-pointing 'explanation' is much easier -- than getting a degree in hydrology or engineering and - going over and helping install irrigations systems in poor countries, using World Bank money or private investment funds. Democrats are very immature and pathetic. They are 'part of the problem' -- but refuse to see this. They need to eventually decide to put away the soap box and GET BUSY - like responsible, mature adults. You can to ahead and try to argue with the Soccer-mom socialists if you want. But they have never been educated about the particular causes behind poverty (natural disasters, for example) and really have no conception of the origins of poverty, wealth and global problems. Until they are, they will probably tend to blindly gun-grab and redistribute income, thinking this will fix the Droughts, floods, new crop diseases etc. (Wealth redistribution does nothing but help a few corrupt dictators get rich with few of the local problems being adequately fixed.) If Dems REALLY "cared," they would roll up their sleeves and WORK HARD - to be productive, and make the world a better place. Instead, they are sad, immature, and pathetic. A few more mechanical engineering majors and a few less "conflict resolution" majors -- that's what the rest of the World needs over the long term. In the face of a drought, a country like Afghanistan or Chad doesn't need "Anger-management" lectures or Grief counselors. They KNOW how to be Angry, just fine. What condescending nonsense 'Peace Studies' and Conflict-Resolution courses are. Pure drivel, and a pathetic waste of taxpayer money. But, that's the direction our colleges are taking today. It's really sad. What the people in these developing counties NEED, is water-resource managers and new, drought-resistant rice crops from students who studied hard as plant-genetics majors. Most people in poor countries aren interested in religious bigotry or a cultural war with the West, they just want to eat every day. Tell the Democrats to leave successful, wealthy countries alone - tell them to stop being part of the problem -- and get themselves into a solid, productive professional field. Too hard, though. Much more fun to piously boohoohoo, whine, burn candles, and etc., for some of them. Hope this approach helps. Don't be nasty about what you say to Liberals. Just express your concern about problems in other areas of the world, and point out REAL solutions, not bogus juvenile ones. Say "We are in agreement -- things need to change." Then show them the way to the nearest Agricultural Engineering department. Good luck!, Pam, in LA :)

[P-Marlowe]

"...well-read (NYT, WP, LAT, NPR, CNN) and educated,"

Well read? Well brainwashed. You don't need to say anything to impress these bozos. If they think anyone who would be afraid to fly with 5 Arab men in first class is a racist, then they must think everyone on Earth, including Arabs are racists.

Even Jesse Jackson has said when he's walkng down a lonely street at night and he sees a gruop of young men approaching he is glad when he finds out they are white.

It is NOT racism, it is pure unadulterated rationalism.

These bozos would never survive in the REAL world. It is easy to be a liberal when sitting in the back of a limosine.

[antivenom]

Liberals believe we live in a democracy...explain to them that the captain took a vote...more hands went up to kick off the Arabs then for the ones to allow them to stay...funny how a democracy works. (heeheehee)

[poet]

Just tell them my favorite definition of a liberal:
A liberal is a person with their two feet firmly planted in the air.
By the way, I'm curious, why would you want to keep these people as friends?

They are, in the final analysis, totalitarians in view of the fact the brook no disension, they will not defend themselves and will bad mouth their own country. appease!, appease! is their rallying cry. Remember, it is next to impossible for an honest man or woman to change a group of dishonest people, in fact, it is more than likely that the honest person will be turned because of the material comforts the dishonest people can offer unless the honest person is extremely strong.

[wattsup]

I would say to them. If a group of 5 Nuns in religious clothes were shown to have committed the same crimes do you think that if you were a passenger in another plane and 5 nuns walked on that you should not suspect them? Would it be discrimination or profiling? I would think you would be smart to question. Why turn your back to a more than average situation because of "possible hurt feelings?" Political correctness has run it course.