Posted on 09/08/2001 8:17:26 AM PDT by timydnuc
I argued with a socialist last night at a cocktail party. I beat her into the dust, but I also came to the "ultimate" realization. Marx is still alive! The way these people argue/debate is to turn your own values upon you, and question you on these.
The perfect example is the debate I had last night. The liberal in question has always known that I am a conservative, she also knew that I was a Catholic, and she knew I was a VietNam Vet.
There was the set up. I generally don't start an argumant with these idiots, but I will sure as hell finish it. She started by a disertation (albiet, lame and scattered, intellectually) on the value of defense of one's beliefs. Her premise was, that if one is a religious individual, and belives in the teachings of the Bible, how can one disobey the 1st Commandment---Thou Shalt Not Kill!. It was an interesting premise but it was aimed directly at me. I sat there and let her go on for about an hour in her blathering. She kept looking at me to make a charge at her, but I was calm, smoking my pipe and drinking my wine ( a real nice Burgandy). She pushed and pushed to make me reply. The rest of our friends were flashing me a look. They respect my position and some admire me for my service, and by beliefs. She was in a crowd that didn't like the blantant confrontation that she was proposing.
At the end of her diatribe I asked if she was finished. She, arrogantly (as liberals do), indicated that she was. I then said the following: "God will judge me for what I have done, NOT you. I don't have to ask for forgiveness from man for defending my country, and for offering my life for my family and my brothers, or the killing of the enemies of these and myself. The enemies of my country and my family and my brothers are MY enemies, and shall die at my hand, or I shall die at theirs. I will always be proud that defended my country, regardless of what some people thought. I stood among the most elite, I stood in defense of liberty, and I stood in the eyes of God. He saw me, and He inspired me. Life is a precious thing, He taught me that. He also taught me that my liberty is given to me by Him, and it is meant to be defended. When I am on the offense, I am gracious and giving. I am a benevolent victor, I am a giving and generious man. When I am on the defanse, I am the enemy's worst nightmare. I will kill the enemy at the perlious loss of my immortal soul to save the liberty that God, Himself, gave me. Therefore, I answer only to the God that gave me the liberty that I killed for, and I refuse to answer to the man that I defended, if that man didn't know God. God made gentle men, he gave them a sense of love and respect for His word, and His commandments. He also put in man, courage. A courage to give up his life for the beliefs that God instilled in his soul, and He intended for all his people. He made a brave man that wouldn't falter in the face of evil and averous. He made a of man faith. I have the faith to know that I will be forgiven for my sins. Some people (flashing a sneer at my opponent) will always be looking for what I have....Faith! May God have mercy on those without faith. For, they are the ones that need that small stretch of the courage that a brave man has, but they are the ones that wouldn't take it, if it was spoon fed to them!"
I was applauded, and she sulked away. Courage wins again...Hallalujah!
"A coward dies a thousand deaths, a brave man dies but one." I've always held that to be true. With every argument with a socialist, I hold it more true.
I'm no different than any other man that ever had to go to war. We were all scared "out of our bejesus belts". We did the most horrible thing in the world to save something that was dear, real, and a part of our soul. It didn't have a price to it, you could barely touch it, but it was there. Why would a man fight, kill, and even die for something so abstract? I couldn't, in a billion words, tell you that. I can only tell you,.... we HAD to do it.
Among the many gift God gave to man were rules and reason. Sometimes they conflict. That's when God stands back and says, "Handle it! I gave you gifts, I gave you rights, you decide........Oh, by the way, I'll be watching.....make Me proud!"
Liberals, Satan aren't we splitting hairs here.
Just being silly.LOL.
Not only is the referenced commandment not number one, it also does not read "Thou shall not kill." In fact it reads "Thou shall not murder .
trek
Isn't it fascinating how these liberals are so quick to spout off this Bible verse and "judge not lest ye be judged", without, first, having any knowledge of the original Hebrew or Greek translation nor any knowledge of that verse in context. The original Hebrew reads, "Thou shall not commit murder". If it's truly wrong to murder, and they are so adamant about that when it comes to war and the death penalty, then how do they defend abortion? (Rhetorical question. I've heard these idiots try to weasel their way out of that one.)
It's also interesting how, even MORE often, they ignore EVERYTHING ELSE the Bible has to say and denigrate the Bible and Christian/Judeo beliefs if they clash with their own personal, liberal opinions. They mock Christianity except for a handful of verses they TRY to use against us.
In the reading of Proverbs recently I was amazed at how often the writers admonish people to not argue with fools. I have a lesbian SIL and believe me, when she's around I pretty much keep my mouth shut. Fortunately, she's smart enough to keep hers shut as well. We mostly talk about the weather and my daughter/her niece. Pleasant conversation, and then I wave a cheerful good-bye when she leaves to go home.
Consider, for example, the Clinton impeachment -- the Republicans were stymied not so much because of cowardice (though in the Senate there was that aplenty), so much as for their continued respect for the rules. The left is never constrained by the rules as they apply to the left, but never hesitate to use the rules to bludgeon conservatives, when it suits their purpose. And we seem to have no honorable response when they do it.
I think your description of fightig the enemies offers a potential way around this -- though the details escape me as to how you could do it in politics without selling our soul in the process.
Thoughts, anyone?
You missed a way to short circuit that assertion in one-tenth the effort. The original Hebrew from which that was translated more accurately means "Thou shalt not murder." I was listening to Bob Grant a while back, and his guest was a Rabbi (an author of numerous works describing leftist attacks on religion) who explained, in great detail, the common mistranslation. Which also squares with the numerous instances of justified violence described in the Bible. But an easy, contextual rebuttal for her stupid assertion would be,
"So, did God punish David for killing Goliath? And if not, why not? Or did he actually help David kill Goliath?"
Leftists always use "Thou shalt not kill" to argue the existence of a "Biblical basis for pacifism," but is entirely a myth, as most leftist dogmas are based on.
By taking up arms, these heroes followed Jewish law and tradition: A Jew may choose to defend against aggressors, but when the threat is ominous, a Jew must fight back. The Talmud, the code of Jewish law, states: "If someone comes to kill you, arise quickly and kill him."[2] The Sixth Commandment, poorly translated as "Thou shalt not kill," is more properly translated from the Hebrew as, "You shall not commit murder." It does not forbid the righteous taking of life. The Book of Exodus (22:1)[3] further confirms this, assuring us that "If a burglar is caught in the act of breaking in, and is struck and killed, it is not considered an act of murder" (assuming the intruder is breaking into our home at night, when it is hardest to judge his intent)."
Yes, but don't forget, in order to be forgiven, you must REPENT.
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