Putin has just discovered the scale of his latest miscalculation

The Telegraph ^

[USA-FRANCE]

President Donald Trump has finally lost patience with Vladimir Putin. Having promised a “major” announcement on Russia, Trump has now confirmed that the US will dramatically increase weapons supplies to Europe for use in Ukraine and threatened 100 per cent secondary tariffs on Russia’s trade partners. Trump would only provide Russia with an off-ramp if Putin agreed to a ceasefire in Ukraine within 50 days.

[SmokingJoe]

See post 260.
Your whines already answered there and in other posts.

[adorno]

“Neither argument goes to the heart of why China can only get ahead by spying and stealing and copying our tech. “

Still true. Again China has more engineers than anyone else, and China works harder than anyone else.

I'll grant you that. But it's only because China was so swamped with so much technology they had to steal and learn and copy and revers-engineer.

That's why China has working rovers on both the moon and on Mars and Europe doesn't.

It's easy to do what others have done before, especially when they're using the same technology which was bought and stolen from the U.S.

Europe is reduced to constantly whining about the Chinese “stealing” technology,

It's not just the Europeans. America and Japan and S.Korea and others have the same issue with China stealing and copying technology.

same arguments Europe made when the Japaneses started taking over technology and electronics back in the day.

The arguments were valid then too. And the U.S. has made the same argument. But China has done more stealing and copying than anyone else in the universe.

"If the Europeans had the same goals as the Chinese, they'd be a lot better at spying and stealing and copying western technology. the Europeans get all the benefits of western technology without having to steal it,"

No truer words eve spoken (or written).

Europe has the same goals, just don't work as hard at innovating as the Chinese.

Like I said before. The Europeans don't have the same goals because the technology is already available to them and are permitted to use it. The Chinese have to steal it to keep up.

BTW, have you noticed how you are always on the defensive and losing all the arguments?

So my advice to you is:

Stop while you're behind, or you risk falling further behind. ;)

[SmokingJoe]

“Like I said before. The Europeans don't have the same goals because the technology is already available to them and are permitted to use it. The Chinese have to steal it to keep up.”

Except Europeans of course want to dominate in technology and space like everyone else.
But then the Europeans just don't work as hard at it as the Chinese do, despite Europe stealing as much US technology as they can.
Again, Europe is yet to have a working rover on Mars, while the Chinese do.
Plus China dominates consumer electronics, make more cars/EV’s than anyone else, dominate the production of solar panels etc etc.
Hard work and innovation have worked out great for China.

[adorno]

Except Europeans of course want to dominate in technology and space like everyone else..

They don't have the same urgency as the Chinese and the Russians to keep up. The Chinese can't dominate because of their culture and form of government. They have to depend on the U.S. or S.Korea or Japan or others, before a technology advancement becomes available for them to steal and copy.

The Chinese don't have people with ambitions or initiatives or incentives to want to do things on their own. The communist government there doesn't allow anyone to do things without government approval.

But then the Europeans just don't work as hard at it as the Chinese do, despite Europe stealing as much US technology as they can.

The Europeans don't have reasons to steal and copy U.S. technology, since what they need is already available. And the U.S. is NOT A RIVAL to Europe. The Chinese and Russians are the rivals and they have to steal and copy in order to try to keep up with the U.S

Again, Europe is yet to have a working rover on Mars, while the Chinese do.

No need for moon expeditions or rovers on Mars. China is only doing the missions in order t claim for propaganda purposes that they too can go to the moon or to Mars. The U.S. says: 'been there, done that'. No big deal and it's no big deal to the Europeans either. Even as the Chines have done those missions, they can't claim that they developed the technology with which to do it; it' was America's stolen and copied technology which the Chinese used.

Plus China dominates consumer electronics, make more cars/EV’s than anyone else, dominate the production of solar panels etc etc.

The do make more stuff than anyone else,but then, they do have the largest consumer base on the planet, and they need to supply that market with the stuff they copied and produced.

So, what NEW technology did the Chinese develop on their own, and which was not already available to the U.S or to Europe?

The Chinese do have a lot of engineers, but most of them are for civil engineering and bridges and roads and even for ship-building and aviation. But, all of those fields are using old technology or stolen technology from the U.S. and elsewhere.

Hard work

Only the work demanded by the government. Non incentive to go it alone in China.

and innovation

If innovation is about stealing and copying technology, then you are correct.

have worked out great for China.

The only thing that worked out great for China is that the U.S. and other countries sent their production facilities and corresponding technology to China. Otherwise, they'd still be in the stone-age of technology. like N.Korea.

But the Chinese are in panic mode lately, after Trump threatened to bring back manufacturing to the U.S.,which would deprive China of all the tech that they've been using. No new manufacturing outsource by the U.S. means that the Chinese would not be able to steal and copy any new tech from us, and the Chinese would have to depend on their own engineers to come up with anything new, but those engineers don't have the same ambitions as Americans, which is the driving force for most new stuff.The government holds back the Chinese people, which I have no doubt are just as capable as the people in other countries. Let the ambitions propel their people and give them incentives and let their initiatives drive them. But, don't hold your breath waiting for any of that to occur; not in China.

Europeans,on the other hand, lost their drive when they basically became dependent on the EU as a whole They used to be more technologically and scientifically inclined as individual nations. They still have most of what they need, so no real panic-driven need for technology as with China.

Meanwhile, in AI computing and quantum computing, the U.S. maintains a huge lead over China, while the Europeans are a close third. China is using AI developed by the U/S., and in quantum computing the Europeans are doing quite well, while China is mostly copying what others come up with first.

[SmokingJoe]

“They don't have the same urgency as the Chinese and the Russians to keep up.”

Oh yes they do.
They just don't have the ability to do it.
Currently Europeans are reduced to making noise as they are racked with impotent jealousy at the massive success of the Chinese in space, cars, electronics etc etc.

” The Chinese can't dominate because of their culture and form of government. “

Reality: The Chinese dominate Europe In cars, electronics, space etc etc and the gap with Europe just keeps getting bigger and bigger.

“They have to depend on the U.S. or S.Korea or Japan or others, before a technology advancement becomes available for them to steal and copy.”

Chuckle.
It seems like only yesterday when the jealous Europeans were saying Japan and S Korea don't invent anything but were stealing/copying from America and Europe, no?
So what happened to that story then?

[SmokingJoe]

“The Chinese don't have people with ambitions or initiatives or incentives to want to do things on their own. The communist government there doesn't allow anyone to do things without government approval.”

Yeah?
The Chinese are so “communist” they currently have a massive 516 Billionaires, who have created such world dominating companies like Tik Tok, Byte Dance, Alibaba, Tencent, XIAOMI, BYD, huge electronics companies, etc etc.
Meanwhile Europe only has 500 Billionaires.
Europe loses yet again.

[SmokingJoe]

“No need for moon expeditions or rovers on Mars.”

Oh yes there is.
Europe has been reting to get to Mars for decades, but Europe has yet to get a working rover to the moon or Mars.
You just don't have the ability to do it.
Stop crying.

” China is only doing the missions in order t claim for propaganda purposes that they too can go to the moon or to Mars. “

They've actually gone and done it.
They can boast about it if they want.
Europe hasn't.
Europe is reduced to hanging on the apron strings of America.
Pathetic.

“The U.S. says: ‘been there, done that’. No big deal and it's no big deal to the Europeans either. “

Big deal for the Europeans but Europe just hasn't.

[Reily]

According to the true definition of Fascism both China and Russia are Fascist states. China has taken on some of the role of Nazi Germany with its Han racial supremacy ideology and Uyghur oppression. This leaves Russia the Fascist Italy (or Falange Spain) role which also kind of fits. I think Italy is the better fit.

[SmokingJoe]

“The do make more stuff than anyone else,but then, they do have the largest consumer base on the planet, and they need to supply that market with the stuff they copied and produced. “

Again India has a bigger population than China but then China totally dominates India in consumer electronics, cars, space etc etc.
Its not the population, its Chinese hard work and innovation.

“The Chinese do have a lot of engineers, but most of them are for civil engineering and bridges and roads and even for ship-building and aviation. But, all of those fields are using old technology or stolen technology from the U.S. and elsewhe”

Wrong again!
Actually, most Engineers produced in China are in Computer Science and Technology. Electrical and Electronics. Mechanical, before Civil.

[SmokingJoe]

“According to the true definition of Fascism both China and Russia are Fascist states”

Actually the Biden regime was more fascist than Russia, after Biden stole the elections then worked hard to try and jail trump on fake made up charges.
Funny how you Democrat crazies who had the most fascist regime in US history under Biden, turn round and accuse others of fascism.

[SmokingJoe]

“China has taken on some of the role of Nazi Germany”

Funniest post of the day.
You need to become a comedian.

[Reily]

But we voted our way out of their Fascist clutches. Being able to throw them out with the ballot box is not a characteristic of a Fascist state.

[Reily]

Tell me how there are not similarities?

[SmokingJoe]

Putin won with over 80% of the vote, in elections held even after the war had started.
Putin has higher approval ratings than Biden ever had.
That's NOT fascism.

[SmokingJoe]

Similarities?
So tell us, just how many Jews did the Chinese government today gas to death in gas chambers like Nazi Germany did?

[dforest]

The liar is back posting more UK BS. Go fix your own hellhole. The muzzards are overtaking it.

[Reily]

I didn’t say anything about Jews.
Try again!

[dforest]

Trump isn’t sending troops. He said he is going to do more sanctions after 50 days.

[SmokingJoe]

“I didn't say anything about Jews.”

You wouldn't would you?
You just claimed the Chinese government were like Nazi Germany, same claims you crazy Democrats made against President Trump, who's son in law and grandchildren are Jews.

[Reily]

So you don’t see any similarities between claims of Han racial superiority by China and claims of Aryan racial superiority by Nazis? You’re also not aware of Chinese oppression of Uyghurs, Tibetans, Mongolians, etc.? 56 ethnic groups in China!