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To: Jonty30

Gonzalo Lira(RIP) said they are using their second their tanks in Ukraine and saving tier 1 in case they have to fight NATO.


6 posted on 01/14/2024 3:39:37 AM PST by Pollard (Hi)
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To: Pollard
Gonzalo Lira(RIP) said they are using their second their tanks in Ukraine and saving tier 1 in case they have to fight NATO.

Complete nonsense, uttered by a wishcasting moron.

Their Tier 1 armor got wiped out or captured in 2022.

Russia’s Only Prototype T-80UM2 Tank Was Destroyed In Ukraine


31 posted on 01/14/2024 4:20:49 AM PST by Timber Rattler ("To be prepared for war is one of the most effectual means of preserving peace." --George Washington)
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To: Pollard
Gonzalo Lira(RIP) said they are using their second their tanks in Ukraine and saving tier 1 in case they have to fight NATO.

At this rate, Putin's invaders will soon be reduced to using their third- and fourth-tier tanks.

Regards,

37 posted on 01/14/2024 4:35:29 AM PST by alexander_busek (Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.)
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To: Pollard

One might argue that moscova held back many of their t-90ms early in the war, perhaps they felt that they did not need them, perhaps they did not want to expose the tank as not the be all they said, nothing hinders export market then seeing your nest and brightest (t-14 is something lol) to destruction by 1000$ drones
Eventually as the T-72s, and 80s were being depleted the t-90 a and s models started to show up and were destroyed, the T-90Ms started showing up and they also were being destroyed sometimes in spectacular explosions. To be fair I have also seen T-90Ms take multiple hits before being destroyed or disabled so it is not a terrible tank, just not the end all be all as advertised.

The Bradly exchange recently with a t-90 shows that. First shot missed and. Bradly peppers it with 25mm till it is no longer operational

I am sure moscova is producing new ones, but at what rate and what value?

Their tanks have proven vulnerable, but so have all tanks to modern warfare, the difference is western tanks tend to be damaged and care survives, not so much for their tanks

To your original point, saving best for battle with NATO, if he did indeed write that it hasn’t aged well


39 posted on 01/14/2024 4:45:08 AM PST by blitz128
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To: Pollard

That is probably closest to the truth.


59 posted on 01/14/2024 5:39:16 AM PST by bigfootbob (Arm Up and Live Free!)
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To: Pollard

I am uncertain about all reports from this conflict on either side, but based on photographs and videos, it is indisputable that Russia has lost a significant portion of their newest equipment in what has become a war of attrition. Russian sources have also confirmed this.

There has been no combined arms maneuver warfare on either side in the last year and it has stagnated into a trench warfare style slugfest with long-range artillery and drones. Tanks and IFV’s have not been very effective in the current style of warfare.

The Ukrainians have fought hard but I do not see how they can win a war of attrition and they have lost their best. Russia lost a lot of their best at the outset too, but in typical Russian fashion they have lots of conscripts now - far more than Ukraine and numbers and “sacrifice” has always been the Russian way, but it takes a decade or more to replace your “best”.

This war has been devastating on both sides and regardless of what happens there will be no winners. We have all lost and the world is far less safe today than it was two years ago.

I will concede that bleeding Russia has been a good thing if you are a neocon and that is who is in charge of our country (much to my disdain), but morally it is repulsive to me that we helped to destroy the Ukraine and geopolitically I think this was a very bad move for the coming decades.

Russia has a very long memory (kinda how we got here in the first place) so the chances of peace between Russia and the West are probably non-existent in my lifetime and we have pushed them towards our ideological foes with a probable price in blood to be paid by our children and grandchildren.


123 posted on 01/14/2024 9:47:00 AM PST by volunbeer (We are living 2nd Thessalonians)
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To: Pollard
Gonzalo Lira(RIP) said they are using their second their tanks in Ukraine and saving tier 1 in case they have to fight NATO.

If that is true then Mr. Lira's large pile of cash may have come straight from Rostov-on-Don.

Only someone privy to internal Russian MOD planning could know that.

138 posted on 01/14/2024 1:16:59 PM PST by freeandfreezing
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