Posted on 08/02/2023 1:51:44 PM PDT by janetjanet998
President Trump and his gaggle of crackpot lawyers asked me to reject electoral votes and chaos would have ensued. To keep faith with the oath that I made to the American people and to Almighty God, I did my duty that day
Weak response. Quite Pence-like.
I’m with you on this one. The idea was simply untenable, at that stage in the game. If Pence had done what Trump requested, they both would have been immediately impeached, and convicted, and Speaker Pelosi would have taken over until Biden was sworn in.
Funny how challenging Ohio's electoral college votes for Republicans in 2005 was no big deal, but similar procedures in 2020 are considered to be illegal, un-Democratic, and unthinkable.
It is worthwhile to read a general description of the election and the aftermath here
One excerpt:
The compromise essentially stated that Southern Democrats would acknowledge Hayes as president by ending their filibuster of the election, on the understanding that Republicans would meet certain demands. The following elements are generally said to be the points of the compromise:
The removal of all remaining U.S. military forces from the former Confederate states. At the time, U.S. troops remained only in Louisiana, South Carolina, and Florida, but the Compromise completed their withdrawal from the region.
The appointment of at least one Southern Democrat to Hayes' cabinet. (David M. Key of Tennessee was appointed as Postmaster General.)
The construction of another transcontinental railroad using the Texas and Pacific in the South (this had been part of the "Scott Plan", proposed by Thomas A. Scott of the Pennsylvania Railroad; he had initiated negotiations resulting in the final compromise).
Legislation to help industrialize the South and restore its economy following the Civil War and Reconstruction.
The right to deal with black people without northern interference.
After the Compromise, a few Democrats complained loudly that Tilden had been cheated. There was talk of forming armed units that would march on Washington, but President Grant tightened military security, and nobody marched on Washington.
You are right, it was very odd.
It might have been much better to have a couple of weeks of turmoil and political discussions instead of having our entire nation descend into banana republic style political persecutions. Ending up with a system where the winners can and do criminally prosecute the outgoing president is much worse in the long run than a little bit of chaos after an election.
There is a reason presidents in banana republics refuse to leave office when they lose elections, they know what happens next.
O.K. But you get my point, anyhow.
I don't have a personal opinion on whether or not the issues presented to Mike Pence reached the level where someone upholding the Constitution should refuse to participate in the process, but I think we can all agree that using the excuse that I was just doing my duty under the law does not absolve anyone from exercising their own moral judgement.
There are plenty of examples throughout history where even if someone has pledged allegiance to the law in effect where they are, that doesn't excuse them from using their own judgement.
As one hypothetical example, if it was well known that nobody in some places could vote in the election due to a natural disaster, or rioting, or a pandemic, or some other situation like local governments blocking people from voting, would we expect the Vice President in that future scenario to just say "I know people didn't get to vote in some states, but I have to certify the electors sent to me anyway"?
False prophet. He hates God. He does the work of Satan.
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I mistrusted that pious fool the first time I watched and listened to him. People criticize Trump for making poor personnel choices but I have to commend him for his uncanny ability to induce so many people to reveal what truly disgusting two-faced scoundrels they actually are. And Pence is a perfect example of that.
Judas Pence. 30 pieces of silver to betray an entire nation.
Much of this leads back to Barr and Wray. They made damn sure the fraud would be protected so back stabbing traitors like Pence can say crap like this.
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Classic Deep State tactics.
which sounded to me like he was part of the FBI false front intended to entrap Flynn and force him out.
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MP was and always will be a pious and totally untrustworthy pr*ck. Unfortunately there are many others just like him in the GOP.
No, stupid... they asked you to wait to certify until all claims of vote fraud were addressed.
But, you cowardly piece of shit’ you certified anyway. You could have stopped this nightmare under Biden.
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All well and truly said and every word of it!
FUMP
Word to the wise: You will lose all credibility in my book if you describe an explicit citation of a clear provision of the U.S. Constitution as a “weak response.”
“If a Congressman and a Senator object, it is his duty not to count until the investigation is complete.”
Incorrect.
It requires an affirmative vote of the full House or Senate to reject an elector.
A single member’s objection means nothing.
The controversy surrounding the election of 1876 was what precipitated the passage of the Electoral Count Act of 1887. I cited it previously in this thread.
On at least one count the 1887 statute is almost certainly unconstitutional. Under the U.S. Constitution, the role of the state legislatures is firmly established. Under the provisions of the Electoral Count Act, however, Congress could (in theory) openly cancel the electoral votes of one or more states even if there was no dispute about the results of those states' electoral vote processes.
Imagine a scenario where Trump wins West Virginia (for example) by a 90%-10% margin over Biden, and the other states have sufficient votes (for some bizarre reason) to: (1) object to those electoral votes under the counting procedure in the joint session of Congress, and (2) successfully vote to reject WV's electoral votes.
This scenario sounds outlandish and is openly at odds with the U.S. Constitution, but under a plain reading of the Electoral Count Act it would be perfectly legal.
Wow!
Pence is really showing his venom against Trump everyday!
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