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The Economics of Green Energy (Can Clean Energy Work?) || Peter Zeihan
Peter Zeihan ^ | 4-24 | Peter Zeihan

Posted on 04/24/2023 6:06:50 AM PDT by dennisw

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mIZUZRVLcP8

(Excerpt) Read more at youtube.com ...


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Foreign Affairs
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mIZUZRVLcP8
1 posted on 04/24/2023 6:06:50 AM PDT by dennisw
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To: dennisw

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mIZUZRVLcP8


2 posted on 04/24/2023 6:07:13 AM PDT by dennisw (This)
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To: dennisw

It can work for the politicians who line their pockets with kickbacks.


3 posted on 04/24/2023 6:08:32 AM PDT by Opinionated Blowhard (When the people find that they can vote themselves money, that will herald the end of the republic.)
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To: dennisw

Clean Energy is a Myth


4 posted on 04/24/2023 6:09:06 AM PDT by butlerweave
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To: Opinionated Blowhard

That is pretty much what it is about. Get a buttload of grants and subsidies for your Green Energy startup, pocket as much cash as possible, then let the company go bankrupt. Wash, rinse, repeat, until you are at least a multimillionaire. Oh, and don’t forget the usual kickbacks to Dem politicians along the way.


5 posted on 04/24/2023 6:11:42 AM PDT by Army Air Corps (Four Fried Chickens and a Coke)
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To: dennisw

How Greening the Economy Will Destroy America
By Llewellyn H. Rockwell, Jr.
April 24, 2023
https://www.lewrockwell.com/2023/04/lew-rockwell/how-greening-the-economy-will-destroy-america/


6 posted on 04/24/2023 6:11:54 AM PDT by afchief
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To: dennisw
So-called "clean energy" doesn't work at all at the utility level (power company). It works well only in a decentralized manner and even then only if all the factors are right for your situation.

The solution for energy and everything else is the free market. Get the government out of the way of energy producers and energy consumers and the free market will pick the cheapest and most efficient uses of energy.

7 posted on 04/24/2023 6:12:38 AM PDT by Tell It Right (1st Thessalonians 5:21 -- Put everything to the test, hold fast to that which is true.)
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To: dennisw

Will wind mills work when the snow is over 10 feet? Will solar panels work when snow covered?


8 posted on 04/24/2023 6:14:25 AM PDT by depressed in 06
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To: dennisw

No, hell no, and you gotta be kiddin’ me no.
Anyone who has a real (not woke) STEM degree knows that.


9 posted on 04/24/2023 6:14:42 AM PDT by Da Coyote
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To: Opinionated Blowhard

And it works for tens of thousands of university professors and thousands of CEOs of startup companies.


10 posted on 04/24/2023 6:17:46 AM PDT by ProtectOurFreedom (I don’t like to think before I say something...I want to be just as surprised as everyone else)
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To: dennisw

The very fact that “green” energy teeters between “will it work?” and “won’t it work?” tells you all you need to know. If it really worked, that question would not even be asked and the free market would be rushing headlong to go all green. The ONLY entity not questioning it is the incredibly stupid, ignorant, and grossly incompetent federal government.


11 posted on 04/24/2023 6:23:42 AM PDT by ProtectOurFreedom (I don’t like to think before I say something...I want to be just as surprised as everyone else)
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To: dennisw

At least Peter looks at these potential sources of converting energy from a realistic perspective. He has solar panels at his house in Colorado. However, that is because solar panels work very well in his location and higher elevation. His house is up in the mountains at 7m’.

He states that solar panels are a horrible idea in other places in the country or world that do not receive X days of sun per year. He gave CT and Germany as an example of places solar panels do not work.

He also states that windmills have their places in the USA that they are much more productive than other places. Chicago(the windy city) is an example of a location that are good for wind mills.

He also has a video about how EVs by 2035 is a pipe dream fantasy. Mostly because he says we would need 10X the current worldwide production of nickle, copper, cobalt, lithium and a few other elements that we are just not capable of doing. Not only to increase battery production but to increase the capacity of the grid.
He states that never in the history of the world(even during WWII) have we ever increased the production of a mineral in a ten year period.

I have been subscribing to his YouTube videos for about a year now. My wife does not like Peter because he is a liberal. However, unlike most liberals, he actually has common sense.


12 posted on 04/24/2023 6:50:08 AM PDT by woodbutcher1963
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To: dennisw

I meant to say that never in a ten year period have we ever increased production 10X.


13 posted on 04/24/2023 6:52:18 AM PDT by woodbutcher1963
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To: dennisw

There is no such thing as green energy. It is as stupid as climate change.


14 posted on 04/24/2023 6:54:04 AM PDT by mulligan (an En bbnnEeThe to)
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To: woodbutcher1963
I could be convinced to incorporate solar and wind power into the grid if there was a way to make fossil fueled power scalable as needed and done in a financial feasible way.

For example, if you have a combination of solar and/or wind with natural gas plants with the idea that the natural gas plant would be off or barely running as long as there's plenty of solar or wind power. But I don't know if the natural gas plant can be designed to work efficiently at low "speed". I know they can be turned up and down some, but if I understand them correctly, when a natural gas fueled plant is turned to a low setting, it's horribly inefficient from a kWh/ft3 perspective.

Until we figure out how to make fossil fueled power efficiently scalable during the day, solar and wind shouldn't be incorporated in the grid.

15 posted on 04/24/2023 6:58:12 AM PDT by Tell It Right (1st Thessalonians 5:21 -- Put everything to the test, hold fast to that which is true.)
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To: dennisw

I think one of the interesting developments in “wind energy” are some of the roof top products that have come out in the last couple years.

There is one that is about ten feet tall and made to mount on the leading edge of warehouse buildings. Large buildings with a flat roof where the building edge is at least 25-30’ off the ground. This design is similar to the shape of an airplane wing. There are two wings mounted vertically. Their shape speeds up the air going through them. It funnels the air through a tube where a turbine is mounted. So there are NO moving blades outside spinning around either on a horizontal or vertical axis.

Here is a video from this dude out of MA:

https://undecidedmf.com/how-can-a-wind-turbine-be-motionless/


16 posted on 04/24/2023 7:00:37 AM PDT by woodbutcher1963
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To: Army Air Corps
Solar panels work. The question is their efficiency in comparison to the cost to manufacture, install and maintain. Therefore, their return on investment. No different than putting in a new natural gas or propane hot water heater.

The return on investment is primarily based on the amount of days of sunshine you get at the place they are installed. Meaning locations like AZ, NM, NV, west TX, and southern CA get on average more days of sunshine than other places. However, states like MA probably give much higher tax credits and a higher NET metering rate than conservative states. Also, solar panels produce electricity at a higher rate than they did when they were first introduced in the 1950s. The other major breakthrough was micro inverters. So, if one panel stops working, it doesn't effect the production of the entire array.

17 posted on 04/24/2023 7:18:27 AM PDT by woodbutcher1963
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To: woodbutcher1963

Yes, you are correct. If someone lives in an area with electricity is priced reasonably and the sun doesn’t shine very much the only way solar cells can pencil out currently is if they are heavily subsidized.

If on the other hand you want to build a house in a place where the nearest power line is miles away... then your other options are going to be fairly expensive also. So alternative sources of electricity need to be carefully considered and might even be your only option.


18 posted on 04/24/2023 8:25:34 AM PDT by fireman15 (Irritating people are the grit from which we fashion our pearl. I provide the grit. You're Welcome.)
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To: woodbutcher1963

Thank you for the interesting link. There is nothing that makes me angrier than seeing miles of ugly taxpayer funded bat and bird chopping monstrosities covering a formerly beautiful landscape. If they can be located a few miles offshore where the wind is steadier and their impact on wildlife and the scenery will be minimal that is fine with me, although salt water is hard on machinery so their expected lifespan is short and maintenance costs are high. The solution presented in the video you shared is the next best solution.


19 posted on 04/24/2023 8:35:29 AM PDT by fireman15 (Irritating people are the grit from which we fashion our pearl. I provide the grit. You're Welcome.)
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To: woodbutcher1963

I am not talking about the panels, just the vast numbers of hucksters who have found a way to milk the taxpayer with companies that were never really intended to function - just siphon vast amounts of cash.


20 posted on 04/24/2023 8:37:24 AM PDT by Army Air Corps (Four Fried Chickens and a Coke)
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