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Russia’s tanks in Ukraine are old, obsolete and failing
Asia Times ^

Posted on 06/07/2022 3:59:46 AM PDT by FarCenter

Russia’s main battle tanks have been chewed up in the Ukraine war. Many of them have been destroyed and left clustered on roadways, some by modern weapons such as the US Javelin, some by Ukraine’s indigenously produced man-portable anti-tank weapons such as the Stugna-P and still others taken out by drones like Turkey’s Bayraktar.

By any modern measure, Russian tanks deployed to the Ukrainian battlefield are old and obsolete. Russia’s armor operations have been criticized by many experts who have noted tank drivers often stay on roadways where they get stuck in traffic jams and are easily ambushed.

They’ve also been frequently used in urban spaces where they are immobile and can’t maneuver.

Russian tanks have been especially vulnerable from above, where Bayraktar drones have taken them out. Other criticism has centered on Russian tank flaws; when a Russian tank is hit, the ammunition – located near the gun system and stored around an automatic loader – “cooks off,” blowing the turret with the gun into the air. Crew survival on Russian tanks after they are hit in Ukraine is poor.

Russia has also been criticized for moving its armor independently of its infantry and not coordinating its artillery and anti-air weapons with its armor operations. Russian troop training is also highly suspect and conscripts driving tanks without adequate training has been a recipe for disaster.

But even if you put aside all these operational errors and problems, the truth is that Russia is fighting with notably old and outdated equipment, making tank survival difficult even if Russia’s field commanders had done everything right and Russia’s soldiers had been well-trained.

(Excerpt) Read more at asiatimes.com ...


TOPICS: News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: globalistpropaganda
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Long article with more detail.
1 posted on 06/07/2022 3:59:46 AM PDT by FarCenter
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To: FarCenter

Made a comment a while back that Putin was cleaning house, per se’, by sending his old equipment to Ukraine. Interesting read.


2 posted on 06/07/2022 4:04:46 AM PDT by cranked
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To: FarCenter

Off topic,but I’m watching “T-34,” a Russian film about the T-34 tank in WW II. It is an amazing film.


3 posted on 06/07/2022 4:09:19 AM PDT by ProtectOurFreedom (Wanting to make America great isn’t an insult unless you’re trying to make it worse! ULTRAMAGA!!)
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To: cranked

That was my thought, too. I’d guess that all Ukraine equipment was/is Russian stock...excluding the US & EU contributions.


4 posted on 06/07/2022 4:17:17 AM PDT by Sacajaweau ( )
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To: FarCenter

When you watch any of the hundreds of Stugna videos, the tanks are being hit from over a mile away, some almost 2 miles.

Without 110% control of the air, that isn’t defendable against. IED’s require a guy to dig a hole in the road. A Stugna allows them to dig a hole 1.5 miles from the road.

Russia will never have control of the air over Ukraine so any advance will be glacial.

Russia got all the land they are going to get in the first week. Since Day 8 its been a “Russia against the world” war of Attrition, and Ukraines hasn’t even received a lot of the “good stuff” yet.

Russia won’t have a military by the end of Summer if they try to take another major city, again.


5 posted on 06/07/2022 4:22:45 AM PDT by UNGN
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To: FarCenter

When you watch any of the hundreds of Stugna videos, the tanks are being hit from over a mile away, some almost 2 miles.

Without 110% control of the air, that isn’t defendable against. IED’s require a guy to dig a hole in the road. A Stugna allows them to dig a hole 1.5 miles from the road.

Russia will never have control of the air over Ukraine so any advance will be glacial.

Russia got all the land they are going to get in the first week. Since Day 8 its been a “Russia against the world” war of Attrition, and Ukraines hasn’t even received a lot of the “good stuff” yet.

Russia won’t have a military by the end of Summer if they try to take another major city, again.


6 posted on 06/07/2022 4:22:45 AM PDT by UNGN
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To: ProtectOurFreedom

We saw that and quite enjoyed it, too.


7 posted on 06/07/2022 4:26:34 AM PDT by ConservativeMind (Trump: Befuddling Democrats, Republicans, and the Media for the benefit of the US and all mankind.)
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To: FarCenter
"While there is no completely reliable information, it often takes as many as five Javelin missiles to destroy a tank when they work. A Javelin missile costs about US$174,000 (the command unit costs $250,000 but is reusable), making Javelins extremely expensive compared to normal gunnery fire."

Would love to see the authors source for this allegation, as most reports show javelin system to be extremely effective.

Javelin missiles in Ukraine: At least 280 Russian armoured vehicles have been destroyed with the American Javelin missile, out of 300 shots fired, according to a report

https://www.ndtv.com/world-news/how-small-ukraine-force-is-killing-russian-tanks-with-us-javelin-missiles-2803289

8 posted on 06/07/2022 4:27:30 AM PDT by tlozo (Trump-the Russian invasion of Ukraine is " truly a crime against humanity")
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To: tlozo

Me too. Untrained operators is most likely the source of the problem.


9 posted on 06/07/2022 4:33:51 AM PDT by mad_as_he$$
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To: cranked

Yes, Putin is clearing out the old.
The people that fight and die are just as disposable as the equipment to him.

The real question isn’t when Russia will out of people fodder, but when does it run out of old tanks? As long as they can sell oil, and have money coming in, they can get ‘parts’ to get equipment out of ‘partially stripped’ storage and back into the field.


10 posted on 06/07/2022 4:49:04 AM PDT by Pete Dovgan
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To: Pete Dovgan

they are now using T-62s in combat...tanks designed in the 1950’s....

Up next, T-28’s and KV-1’s

Yep, just mopping up!


11 posted on 06/07/2022 4:52:12 AM PDT by FreshPrince
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To: ProtectOurFreedom

I’ve seen that recommended, will have to watch it.

These guys have two, and a ton of other historic armor. Well worth the visit.

https://www.americanheritagemuseum.org/jml/russian-t-34-85-model-44/


12 posted on 06/07/2022 4:52:45 AM PDT by FreedomPoster (Islam delenda est)
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To: FreshPrince

https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/ancient-russian-t-62-tanks-spotted-wearing-cage-armor-in-ukraine


13 posted on 06/07/2022 4:52:53 AM PDT by FreshPrince
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To: tlozo

$174,000?

That would make the Javelin is nine times as expensive as Stugna.

According to wikipedia, the Javelin costs in excess of $200,000. So, that makes it ten times as expensive.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FGM-148_Javelin

Is this high cost the general rule? Shouldn’t we send $4.4 billion of aid to Ukraine, so they can produce low cost weapons, instead of sending them $44 billion of our crazy expensive weapons?


14 posted on 06/07/2022 4:53:12 AM PDT by Redmen4ever
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To: cranked

That does not make sense. The cost of leading with your worst equipment is that you will have higher casualties in your tank units, and also those units they support.

Since Russia has by this time deployed most of its best units in Ukraine, the theory is completely unbelievable. If the best stuff is not with, say, the 4th Guards Tank Division or the 2nd Guards Motor Rifle Division, it doesn’t exist.

Russias limiting resource is trained troops. It cant afford to lose them.


15 posted on 06/07/2022 4:54:12 AM PDT by buwaya (Strategic imperatives )
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To: Pete Dovgan

The real question isn’t when Russia will out of people fodder, but when does it run out of old tanks? As long as they can sell oil, and have money coming in, they can get ‘parts’ to get equipment out of ‘partially stripped’ storage and back into the field.


It takes more than money to make supply chains cough up—and very often it is the same set of parts that go on the same models. I recall reading about some weapons system that was going to be problematic for Russia to keep going as the manufacturer and supplier was located in Ukraine. Talk about shooting yourself in the foot.


16 posted on 06/07/2022 4:54:28 AM PDT by Hieronymus
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To: FarCenter

Putin is playing rope a dope.


17 posted on 06/07/2022 4:57:22 AM PDT by anton
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To: Pete Dovgan
Yes, Putin is clearing out the old.

Russia has lost hundreds of T-72B3 tanks. These are T-72 tanks upgraded after 2010 and 2016. Not exactly "old".

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/T-72_operators_and_variants

18 posted on 06/07/2022 4:59:28 AM PDT by tlozo (Trump-the Russian invasion of Ukraine is " truly a crime against humanity")
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To: Redmen4ever

That makes lots of sense, given time. Unfortunately there is no time to expand Stugna production to meet current tactical needs, much less under the difficult conditions currently prevailing.
Ukraine needs munitions immediately.

The real problem here is with the US, in that US weapons are ridiculously expensive due to massive inefficiencies in procurement.


19 posted on 06/07/2022 4:59:34 AM PDT by buwaya (Strategic imperatives )
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To: tlozo

The “report” is a laughable driver. If they’d show 280 wrecks with the effects of Javelin warhead I’d believe. And we are yet to see one wreck. That resembles the reports of Stinger missiles allegedly defeated the Soviet army in A-stan. In reality, the manpads of all types only downed 19 helicopters there.


20 posted on 06/07/2022 5:02:53 AM PDT by NorseViking
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