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Facing Unpleasant Facts: What You aren’t Supposed To Say about the War In Ukraine
CD Media ^ | March 19, 2022 | CD Media Staff

Posted on 05/24/2022 8:03:13 AM PDT by SoConPubbie

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To: Paleo Conservative

I’m trying to remember when it became fashionable for conservatives to promote the idea that protecting radical Islamic royal families in some Middle Eastern sh!t-hole was ever a good idea.


41 posted on 05/24/2022 9:14:08 AM PDT by Alberta's Child ("It's midnight in Manhattan. This is no time to get cute; it's a mad dog's promenade.")
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To: Jan_Sobieski

You know nothing. He was the one who stole the election. He was very unpopular.


42 posted on 05/24/2022 9:19:57 AM PDT by boxlunch (10th Amendmt: nullification or Texit? PS We're in a hot war: globalists, CCP, media, Dems, RINOs)
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To: Alberta's Child

Well protecting them against even worse dictatorship was in our interest. Saddam Hussein wanted to control most of the middle east oil. Were it not for the rapid deployment of A-10’s in August 1999, he probably would have invaded Saudi Arabia too. Allowing him to control almost 50% of worldwide known oil reserves would not have been a good idea.


43 posted on 05/24/2022 9:20:39 AM PDT by Paleo Conservative
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To: Yashcheritsiy

I concur!


44 posted on 05/24/2022 9:21:20 AM PDT by DarthVader (Not by speeches & majority decisions will the great issues of the day be decided but by Blood & Iron)
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To: Alberta's Child

I always assumed anything goes to protect the petrodollar.


45 posted on 05/24/2022 9:28:32 AM PDT by Unassuaged (I have shocking data relevant to the conversation!)
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To: Jan_Sobieski

The purpose of the Budapest Memorandum was to guarantee against any loss of Ukrainian sovereignty, prevent any invasion by the superpowers, and ensure its borders remained intact.

Some people seem to think an EU Free Trade Association agreement or the provision of military assistance and training violates the Memorandum but they’re wrong. Ukraine remained in control of its own economy and borders; it still was able to hold elections and referenda; it wasn’t completely subservient to either Moscow or Washington; it could walk away from the table if it didn’t like the offer.

Russia’s “mothball the EU deal, and give us total control over your economy by the back door, and we’ll install you as a defacto President for Life like Lukashenko is in Belarus” deal with Yanukovych DID break the Memorandum. Because it would’ve handed Kiev over to Moscow the minute Ukraine failed to keep up its repayments.

Don’t forget, a few years earlier Russia poisoned Yanykovych’s election opponent. Yanukovych win anyway. But if his rival had died from the poisoning, Yanukovych would’ve won by default and done so by the direct action of Russia.

Obama didn’t go anywhere near as far as Putin did. So both sides are wrong, but Russia got there first and did the worst.


46 posted on 05/24/2022 9:29:49 AM PDT by MalPearce
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To: SoConPubbie; Yashcheritsiy; DarthVader
Let’s be honest, the only rational position in this for an American to take is to feel sorry for the Ukrainian people, but to stay as far away from actual involvement as possible. The Ukrainian regime doesn’t deserve any more of our support than does the Russian one.

Allowing Russian forces to occupy Ukraine would put them in an ideal place to attack Poland, Moldova, and Romania. Back when the Soviets had a starting point in the middle of Germany, their war plans were to drive all the way to the English Channel and Atlantic Ocean.

47 posted on 05/24/2022 9:31:52 AM PDT by Paleo Conservative
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To: Paleo Conservative

Shhhhhh don’t tell anyone, but I’m evading the ban!


48 posted on 05/24/2022 9:34:40 AM PDT by Yashcheritsiy (I'd rather have one king 3000 miles away that 3000 kings one mile away)
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To: Paleo Conservative; SoConPubbie; DarthVader
Allowing Russian forces to occupy Ukraine would put them in an ideal place to attack Poland, Moldova, and Romania. Back when the Soviets had a starting point in the middle of Germany, their war plans were to drive all the way to the English Channel and Atlantic Ocean.

But what reasonable person actually thinks the Russians want to do any of this?

49 posted on 05/24/2022 9:36:37 AM PDT by Yashcheritsiy (I'd rather have one king 3000 miles away that 3000 kings one mile away)
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To: Alberta's Child
Our foreign policy is a joke. Supposedly there is some high-level discussion among intellectuals about whether our foreign policy should be more idealistic or more realistic.

The reality is that the supposedly idealistic side are the neocons who claim they are making the world safe for democracy when in fact they just want to make the world safe for cheap Chinese products.

Meanwhile the realists have been hijacked by those who believe that keeping it real means keeping money flowing to the Military Industrial Complex.

The oligarchs refuse to identify themselves and act as the elite leaders they are supposed to be. Why can't we behave like a true empire? Only enter wars that benefit our empire, and completely destroy anyone that gets in the way.

Instead our oligarchs hide behind a thin veil of democracy and engage in deceitful and half-baked proxy wars where nothing is ever settled.

The only calculations that are made is regarding the balance of money going to the MIC vs. that going to globalist multinationals. Too much war is bad for business. Too little war is bad for the MIC.

That's the real intellectual debate that is going on.

50 posted on 05/24/2022 9:49:53 AM PDT by who_would_fardels_bear (This is not a tagline.)
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To: Yashcheritsiy
But what reasonable person actually thinks the Russians want to do any of this?

Peter Zeihan says Russia won't feel safe unless it controls all the passes to its territory. They will want to control everything from the Vistula river in Poland down to the Bessarabian gap in Moldova and Romania. In order to feel secure, they have to control countries that contain over twice the population of Russia. This war in Ukraine is the last time Russia has an opportunity to expand its control over strategic gaps before its demographic decline makes their military unable to do it.

https://zeihan.com

51 posted on 05/24/2022 9:52:55 AM PDT by Paleo Conservative
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To: SoConPubbie

“ it has been disappointing to see the American public once again so easily led down the path to supporting a war that never had to be—never would have been—but for the policies enacted by our government.”

THIS ^^^^^ 1000 times 🤪


52 posted on 05/24/2022 10:04:20 AM PDT by NWFree (Somebody has to say it)
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To: ConservativeMind
Can you please tell those of us on Free Republic what we should have figured out concerning the righteousness of Iraq invading Kuwait? We are really curious.

Kuwait was slant drilling oil from Iraqi oil fields and selling it outside OPEC, laughing all the way to the bank.

https://www.worldatlas.com/articles/invasion-of-kuwait-why-did-iraq-invade-kuwait.html

53 posted on 05/24/2022 10:25:41 AM PDT by T.B. Yoits
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To: T.B. Yoits

All I can find is that Iraq accused Kuwait of that, but never had proof.

Saddam had plenty of desires for his other neighbors, too.


54 posted on 05/24/2022 10:47:25 AM PDT by ConservativeMind (Trump: Befuddling Democrats, Republicans, and the Media for the benefit of the US and all mankind.)
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To: SoConPubbie
The “Revolution of Dignity” Was a US-Backed Coup

The majority of the Ukrainian People are grateful that it happened.

There Is a Significant Neo-Nazi Problem in Ukraine

White Supremacists, huh? In his Inaugural Speech, Biden likewise identified "White Supremacy" as the greatest threat to America / democracy. Don't care.

The Russians Always Objected to NATO Expansion into Ukraine

Don't care. Russians don't have a say in the matter. Next objection?

Biden Could Have Prevented the War

Irrelevant. The war is here!

Regards,

55 posted on 05/24/2022 10:58:17 AM PDT by alexander_busek (Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.)
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To: jimwatx

All you have to see is all the Int’l Leaders showing up In Kiev to see why this war happened. They’ve all got a stake in Ukraine. Us and Eropean Leaders want their share.

Ukraine will never be run by it’s people - never.


56 posted on 05/24/2022 11:03:42 AM PDT by caww ( )
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To: Fido969

No, there was another reason as well. They know all the crimes he has committed, and he needed that not to come out.


57 posted on 05/24/2022 11:55:52 AM PDT by Robert DeLong
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To: boxlunch

How did Yanukovich steal an election he won fair and square with almost 50% of the vote?


58 posted on 05/24/2022 12:02:31 PM PDT by Jan_Sobieski (Sanctification)
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To: ConservativeMind
Oh, they were doing it alright, just like had happened in Texas, leading to indictments in the early 1960s.

Bush Senior, originally from Connecticut, relocated to Texas. He knew the drill. (pun intended)

59 posted on 05/24/2022 12:21:49 PM PDT by T.B. Yoits
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To: Paleo Conservative
Hey Genius…If the Ukrainians were United in opposition to Yanukovich, they would have voted him out. Revolutions don’t occur in Democracies. Putin didn’t force Donetsk and Luhansk to Secede. Putin also didn’t force Ukraine to kill its own citizens for the last 8 years.

The only thing I am ashamed of is how uninformed and propagandized so-called conservatives have become.
60 posted on 05/24/2022 12:26:54 PM PDT by Jan_Sobieski (Sanctification)
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