Posted on 04/17/2022 3:36:23 PM PDT by SpeedyInTexas
The first image of the guided missile cruiser Moskva of the Russian Navy that sank a few days ago, via @Bormanike.
Depending on the side you choose to believe, the ship was either hit by 2x R-360 "Neptun" ASMs, or suffered a catastrophic ammunition fire. You decide.
(Excerpt) Read more at mobile.twitter.com ...
“More has to be going on because something didn’t work.”
The search and targeting radars were pointed in the other direction as the crew was transfixed by the TB2 drone show on the side away from the Neptune launchers. Not a mistake our navy would likely make. And any navy, certainly not more than once.
Kursk was lost in fairly shallow water. Russians were able to find her and lower diving bells to her, but proved unable to do anything with them there. Rough weather in the Barents sea was part of their problem. Dutch and other tech eventually secured entry for Russian divers. Then raised most of the wreck.
More example of russians being the laughing stock of the world. And that’ll piss a bunch of freepers off.
It would be incredibly stupid for US to make such an attempt at this time! Vlad is already mad in general and at the west, including US. Some of his mouthpieces accusing us of already escalating towards WWIII. They're waving their nuke around. To give him an excuse to escalate in our direction, with zero deniability or secrecy on our part, over an issue on which Russians are apt to think emotionally rather than rationally, is asking to start the equivalent of George Floyd riots with nukes. We want to strengthen the influence of any wise, cautious Russians remaining.
Yep, same mentality as giving BLM their rights to riot and so on. It’s the whole ‘might makes right’ thing.
Yes, they screwed up big losing the Kursk. And their initial frantic efforts, when there was still a plausible chance to save a few, went incomplete. However, they won a lot of respect from me with their effort to recover their bodies, to raise the wreck, even when they had to accept foreign help and risk losing face. And they not only conducted an adequate investigation into the causes of her loss; they were willing to accept the results. Even though it cost them more face. Maybe not perfect, but inconceivably better than how it would have been done a generation before. Yes their leadership still can be laughable. But then look at ours. And our navy, under them, has had plenty of laugh until you cry moments. After my parents visited USSR in 80s they reported the Russians had lost their souls. It’s slow, but I prefer to look for evidence they’re growing some back.
Only thing I can say is they lost all respect when they had to get a foreign power to actually clean up the bodies. They feigned nobody died for a long time, like the USSR did with Chernobyl that nobody was hurt.
The Russian/Soviet government isn’t just nasty, it’s beyond an reproach! From 1924 to today!
“the ship’s radar can see only in the forward 180* has a blind spot aft (I can not confirm this).”
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At least three kinds of radar need to be distinguished from each other, the irdinary navigational radar, the high-power and long-range fire control system that feeds into the ship’s equivalent of the U.S. Navy’s Combat Information Center, and the separate specialized radar transmitter and receiver systems that are built into and physically mounted on the two (I think) “gatling gun” CIWS systems designed to take out incoming missiles that get past all other defensive systems.
The Fire Control radar would identify and track incoming missiles and control all long- and mid-range defensive systems.
I’d be surprised to learn that there would be any azumuthal blind spot at all with respect to the ship’s Fire Control radar. It’s possible that FC radar might have some difficulty distinguishing fast-moving incoming missiles from noise if the missiles are streaking in a few feet over the wavetops. Also, and based on the reports of where missile impact took place this doesn’t appear to be a factor, but shipboard FC radar typically has a blind spot with respect to any missiles coming straight down from directly vertically above the ship. These last two would be “elevational” blind spots.
Ships with fully functional CIWS systems have at least two independent gun mounts that, with their high-speed oscillation onboard radar, “paint” or “patrol” dedicated azimuthal sectors that, when combined, typically afford 360 degree coverage (custom cutouts being built in to prevent the CIWS guns from hitting nearby or adjacent parts of the ship’s own superstructure).
US land based ICBMs were designed to withstand EMP/TREE/SGEMP effects from nuclear explosions (not close by, of course). The Peacekeeper ICBM (now decommissioned) was far better at this than the Minuteman 3 ICBM. I worked on the Peacekeeper ICBM 4th stage (post boost) Nuclear Hardness & Survivability and know this for a fact. I would expect that the MM3 would be better after refurbishment and the addition of updated guidance and inertial nav that was based on that of the Peacekeeper.
I heard the Ukes were bugging them all week with the drones and had their responses nailed down.
I thought the story of one of her radars having a big blind spot was odd. I have heard stories like that about Russian ships before, and if there is any truth to it Ukraine would know since they built her. So I included the comment with the caveat.
Russian ships typically have more radars and fire control radars than NATO ships. For the Slava, she has six directors for her guns and missiles, and passive electronic surveillance and decoys. Even if she had limits due to construction, age, and dated systems, that is still a lot of radar and weapons for a pair of missiles to get through to hit her.
Her sinking raises a lot of questions about how it happened.
Russian ships and electronics are garbage, that’s why.
In July, 1989, while briefly attached to destroyer USS Stump, I saw a sister ship of the Moskva, the Slava class cruiser Marshal Ustinov, pull into and tie up at a pier at the Norfolk Naval Station in Norfolk, VA
It was awesome looking, with a pyramidal shape going up from the waterline when you see it dead on from in front of it, as I was fortunate enough yo do. Lots of layers to that cake, as you said.
Here are some related news stories. The last link shows a .jpg photograph if the Marshal Ustinov underway in the channel in Norfolk.
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NEWS
SOVIET WARSHIPS DUE IN NORFOLK
By A.J. PLUNKETT Staff Writer
DailyPress.com
Jun 07, 1989 at 12:00 am
NORFOLK — In an example of the advances of glasnost and trust between two sworn enemies, three Soviet Navy ships will visit Norfolk Naval Base for four days next month.
The visit, scheduled for July 21-25, will bring about 1,100 Soviet naval personnel within the boundaries of the United States’ largest Navy base and close to U.S Navy ships off limits to most American citizens.
In return, several U.S. Navy ships will visit a Soviet port, yet to be named, later this summer, according to a statement released by the headquarters of the U.S. Atlantic Fleet in Norfolk Tuesday.
The Soviet ships, which will be berthed at the Norfolk base’s Pier 7, will include the Slava-class guided missile cruiser Marshal Ustinov, the Sovremenny-class destroyer Otlichny and the Boris Chilkin-class oiler Genrikh Gasanov.
A small number of Soviet civilians will also be included in the visiting party, commanded by the first deputy commander-in-chief of the Soviet Northern Fleet, Vice Adm. Igor Vladimirovich Kasatonov.
Security will be adequate to protect the Soviets during their visit, said an Atlantic Fleet spokesman.
The courtesy call is the product of discussions started last summer when Gen. Sergei Akhromeyev, marshal of the Soviet Union, visited the United States as the guest of the chairman of the U.S. joint chiefs of staff, Adm. William J. Crowe.
The visit will be the first time a Soviet naval vessel has called at a U.S. port since 1975 and only the second time since 1945. In May 1975 a Soviet warship visited Boston harbor in a similar exchange visit to commemorate the 30th anniversary of the end of World War II.
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U.S. Navy welcomes Soviets
By MITCHELL MILLER
JULY 21, 1989
NORFOLK, Va. — Three Soviet warships steamed into port at the Norfolk Naval Station Friday, initiating an historic and unprecedented five-day visit to the world’s largest naval installation.
The Soviet ships, carrying 1,100 personnel, sailed through the Chesapeake Bay into the port of Hampton Roads, accompanied by several Coast Guard vessels.
Before reaching port the ships engaged in an elaborate exchange of military goodwill that included cannons booming international greetings.
The Slava-class Marshal Ustinov, the Sovremenny-class destroyer Otlichny and the Boris Chilikin-class oiler Genrikh Gasanov, their path cleared by tug boats, pulled in slightly ahead of schedule, accompanied by an American flotilla of Coast Guard vessels and aircraft.
The Ustinov, the 613-foot Soviet flagship, was the first to pull into port at 8:15 a.m. EDT. Ropes from the ship’s bow, which bears the Communist red star, were thrown to waiting American sailors on Pier 7 and the ship was secured.
Dozens of Soviet sailors dressed in pressed white uniforms lined the deck, and a handful of officers clad in cream-colored uniforms could be seen near the top of the ship, which carries a crew of about 450. A U.S. Navy band played American and Soviet martial music.
High atop the Ustinov, an American flag was waving in the breeze.
Across the pier and parallel to the Soviet vessel, dozens of U.S. sailors aboard the guided missile cruiser USS Harry E. Yarnell faced their Russian counterparts.
Excited U.S. sailors and officers scurried about on their pier to get a good look at the Soviet ship. Lt. Cmdr. Mike John called the Soviet ship ‘awesome.’
‘This is a chance to show America, to exchange Navy formalities, as well as have a little bit of fun, Navy to Navy,’ John said.
The Soviet Embassy in Washington said this week that there are no nuclear weapons aboard its three ships.
Under U.S. Navy policy, officials neither deny nor confirm the presence of nuclear weapons on American ships. The Navy also does not comment on nuclear weapons aboard foreign vessels.
As the Soviet warships sailed into port they exchanged military salutes with American officials.
The Soviet ships fired a 21-gun salute to the United States, which was answered by a 21-gun salute from a battery of howitzers at Fort Monroe, one of the nation’s oldest military bases.
The two nations also exchanged cannon salutes honoring Adm. Powell Carter, commander in chief of the U.S. Atlantic Fleet, and Vice Adm. Igor Vladimirovich Kasatonov, first deputy commander in chief for the Soviet Northern Fleet.
The fanfare inaugurated a rare and unique Soviet visit. No Soviet warship has previously visited a U.S. military port, the Navy said.
The crews of the Soviet ships are matched with those of three U.S. ships in Norfolk, Navy officials said. The ships are the Yarnell, the destroyer USS Peterson and the oiler USS Milwaukee.
‘It gives us an opportunity to look at their ships and certainly it gives them an opportunity to look at ours,’ said Lt. Cmdr. Steve Burnett of the U.S. Atlantic Fleet. ‘What it means is people-to-people understanding.’
A wide range of cross-cultural activities involving Soviet and U.S. sailors are planned throughout the weekend.
Soviet sailors will meet their American counterparts during tours of area military installations, cookouts with host U.S. ship sailors and their families, as well as volleyball, basketball and soccer matches.
Soviet sailors will also visit Busch Gardens in Williamsburg, check out a minor league baseball game, an auto assembly plant, a mall and restaurants, including McDonald’s.
Two of the Soviet ships will be open to the public during the weekend, but people must have special passes that were distributed this week. The Soviet ships are to pull out of port next Tuesday.
The last time Soviet warships visited the United States was May 12, 1975, when two Kanin-class guided missile destroyers pulled into Boston Harbor for a six-day visit.
To reciprocate this week’s visit, three U.S. Navy ships carrying 1,200 personnel will visit the Soviet Black Sea port of Sevastopol in Crimea Aug. 4-8.re a soggy summer has brought record rain to some areas, and a flash flood watch was posted for portions of Nevada, the National Weather Service said.
One person drowned Thursday when a rain-swollen northern Virginia creek became a river and swept away a pickup truck. Authorities searched the same creek Friday for a second car believed to have two or three occupants.
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File:Cruiser Marshal Ustinov leaving Norfolk 1989.jpg
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File:Cruiser Marshal Ustinov leaving Norfolk 1989.jpg
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English: The Soviet Slava Class Guided Missile Cruiser MARSHAL USTINOV (CG 088) passes by Fort Monroe as it leaves Hampton Roads. The MARSHAL USTINOV, the Guided Missile Destroyer OTLICHNYY (DDG 434) and the Replenishment Oiler GENRIKH GASANOV are ending a five-day goodwill visit to Naval Base, Norfolk, Virginia (VA). The visit was the first to an American military port by ships of the Soviet navy.
Deutsch: Raketenkreuzer Marschall Ustinow
Check out this photo taken onboard the Moskva decades ago.
The deck seems to have been rust colored even then.
Is it actual rust, or rust-colored nonskid? You make the call.
Check out this photo taken onboard the Moskva decades ago.
The deck seems to have been rust colored even then.
Is it actual rust, or rust-colored nonskid? You make the call.
Check out this photo taken onboard the Moskva decades ago.
The deck seems to have been rust colored even then.
Is it actual rust, or rust-colored nonskid? You make the call.
Check out this photo taken onboard the Moskva decades ago.
The deck seems to have been rust colored even then.
Is it actual rust, or rust-colored nonskid? You make the call.
I remember that :)
Great point.
I had a guy that worked for me in the mid 1990s that had just come off of attack boats as a nuclear propulsion officer. He definitely felt that way. He couldn’t say much, but what he could say was eye opening.
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