Posted on 05/12/2020 10:56:45 AM PDT by conservative98
Accessory to murder perhaps.
Depends on why he was out there.
Presumptive story is:
the chasers called him.
He came out.
Runner turned around to evade him.
Runner then had the option to pass the truck or turn around and avoid the newcomer.
So again, why was he there?
Where did he start off at?
How did he know what was going on?
Why was he filming ?
They didn't chase him down. They went to the entrance to their community, and waited for Arbery to try to leave, because that was the only way to get out of the community. It was surrounded by water you know.
Also, if you are a older fat tub of lard, you will most definitely need to arm yourself if you get into a confrontation with a strong athletic young man.
and confronting him with lethal force is NOT self-defense.
He wasn't being confronted with lethal force until he attacked the man holding the shotgun. At that point it became a matter of self defense.
The crowd demands blood. The authorities are staging a circus for them.
“Arming yourself and then chasing down an unarmed man and confronting him with lethal force is NOT self-defense.”
True. But the real world isn’t that simple. They went outside to confront a burglar, so they were armed. If you went outside to confront a trespasser on your place or you neighbor because you knew they were not home, you would likely elect to go armed.
The son was standing in the street waiting for him. Not a great move, but he was legally armed, and legally trying to get the guy to stop. They had already told him to stop and talk because the police were on the way.
It became self defense when Arbery looped around the truck and grabbed the shotgun and tried to wrestle it away. At that point he was shot through the hand and started punching him in the head while still yanking at the gun. When two people wrestle for a gun, both are considered armed legally.
It wasn’t a murder plot, but they knew who he was and he knew them. He wasn’t innocent and just out jogging. He went into the house normal looking, and then a few minutes later fled out the door like a bat outta hell.
And when he saw neighbors, he didn’t stop and explain himself, or seem confused like an innocent man.
He went at him from quite a distance, looped around and attacked him.
On this one, i think it would be good to let this develop a bit more. They citizens were not perfect and made mistakes. But they were armed for protection, and never pointed a gun at him. He attacked, like a street educated guy trying not to get arrested would.
Look closer at the road surface where the camera is aimed. That dark object lying on the road has been reported to have been a hammer which Arbery dropped. If you look, the guy holding the camera is trying to keep the hammer in the center of the frame as he drives up to it.
I guess he thought it would be important to show that Arbery was armed just before he ran up to the truck. I guess Arbery dropped the hammer because at that distance he could see the McMichaels were both armed, and he probably thought in his own mind that if they have me holding that hammer, they can shoot me dead and get away with it.
From what i've read, that third shot was the fatal one. First shot went through his palm. Second shot grazed his head, but that third shot went into his torso, and that's the one that killed him.
Yes we do. I've read the official police report, and I've also read what DA Barnhill wrote on the matter.
But if that person you are chasing off the property tries to wrestle (rassle) your pistol away from you, and as you grapple he gets shot...that IS self defense. And it doesn’t not become so, simply because you had the temerity to arm yourself when you went out to confront him.
And this is true. If this criminal had been a white thief, nobody would give a crap about him getting shot. The McMichaels would be hailed as heroes for getting rid of a criminal and saving everybody a lot of trouble.
But because he's black, the media have created a political uproar, and now the government is conducting a show trial.
“Say I am a completely innocent person and am jogging down my street and there is a truck parked in the way so I jog around it...when I get to the front of the truck you stick a shotgun in my face and tell me to stop. I now feel threatened and in fear for my life so I grab for the gun. You shoot and kill me. Who committed the crime?”
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Hypotheticals don’t appear to be your strong suit.
Where do you work in the part about you dropping the hammer you were carrying when you see the armed men in front of you?
Also, where did you get that hammer? Did you steal it off the house you invaded?
Oh wait. You said you were a "completely innocent person", so I guess you wouldn't have to worry about the hammer. Also, why would two guys with guns be wanting to stop you?
Crump should have been disbarred for his obstruction of justice after the Zimmerman trial was over.
Good catch. I finally see the hammer. I agree that is what he was doing, filming the hammer in the street. Which tells me that he had no idea that someone was about to be shot. He was more interested in the stolen hammer for a few seconds than anything else.
And the bad guy made quite a deft move. A fake left, then around the right side of the truck and hooking around to attack the guy from the front of the truck.
And don’t kid yourself. Thugs and yardbirds practice moves like that for use on cops. There are numerous prison videos of convicts practicing on each other. He wasn’t some “jogger”. He made a stupid move and got killed. And two imperfect but well-meaning guys got their lives torn apart by his crime and reaction to being caught.
They were the good guys, he was the bad. And two 85 year olds paid for it with their life up in that cemetery.
Now they are down to claiming self-defense due to the dead guy trying to take McMichael’s gun away.
I think you have this backwards. I wouldn't have believed it if I hadn't seen it in the video.
It is far more believable that two racist rednecks murdered a black man in cold blood then that this fellow rushes a man with a shotgun.
Without video, those guys would have a hard time proving they didn't just murder the guy, because *NOBODY* is going to believe he just attacked the guy holding the shotgun.
Nobody is going to believe that. The video proves that is what actually happened.
Hey, doesn’t everyone carry a hammer when out for a jog?
I have my own idea about it... Let's just say that I've been to CCW class twice, and had... other training in self defense and the law in my home state as well, and leave it at that. Oh yeah, I did stay at a Holiday Inn last nite.
Welcome to FR, BTW. :)
The elder McMichael was a cop that worked a case with Arbery. He knew who Arbery was, and knew he was a criminal. He also claims to have seen video/images of Arbery inside that house which had had things stolen from it in October, and he recognized Arbery.
Also, Arbery's brother is a criminal, and the cop probably knew him too.
Yes he did, and if you look what was on the road in the center of the frame when he turned the lens, you will see he was showing the hammer lying on the road as he drove up. It has been stated that Arbery dropped that hammer, and it appears the video guy wanted people to see that hammer lying there in the road.
Go look at the video. That long black spot in the road was a hammer, and *THAT* is why the guy turned the lens on purpose.
Congratulations, you just explained MeganC's point.
I'll translate: "THIS, CCW students, is a case in point why we don't pursue a fleeing felon who is not an immediate threat to life or safety, and why you will answer to the law if you do. Leave that to the real cops."
Yes, self defense. You attack a man with a shotgun, he shoots back in response.
Two dumbasses who don’t like a black guy in the neighborhood.
If he was to be shot just for being in the neighborhood, they would have shot him the first time they confronted him. They could have also shot him as he was running up to the truck. They did not. Junior McMichael finally shot him when the stupid bastard attacked him.
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