Posted on 02/22/2020 3:28:59 AM PST by Kaslin
He killed his grandmother. And he did so brutally, dumping her in the water before she was even dead, if the coroner is correct that her cause of death was drowning. He killed two others -- all evil acts. And then once in prison, he managed to kill a fellow inmate. So, I get why the governor of Tennessee refused to grant Nick Sutton clemency when the time came for his execution and final appeals.
But no one was asking for the man to be released. Instead, people -- including prison staff and the sister of the inmate he killed -- were advocating for Sutton's life. In the 34 years since he had been on death row, Sutton had done what you would hope would happen in prison. He changed. He started caring about others. Based on his last words, he became a man of faith. He even saved the lives of prison staff when inmates got violent. One former corrections officer whose life Sutton saved said in a plea to the governor that if Sutton were released from prison tomorrow, he would welcome Sutton in his home and as a neighbor.
Yes, Sutton's crimes were evil. They were also committed by a teenager whose mother abandoned him and whose father abused him. Reports indicated that as a child, his father introduced Sutton to drugs. Sutton's father later committed suicide.
It's all so miserable. And even more so, of course, for the families of those Sutton killed all those years ago. On social media, I saw a lot of burn-in-hell, this-should-have-happened-years-ago kind of comments. I couldn't help but think about mercy. Justice is crucial. But so is mercy. To have the civic and moral imagination to care that a person who has done heinous things may actually be a person whose life has value -- the kind of value he didn't see in others -- seems to be an important thing.
This all happened around the fifth anniversary of the mostly Coptic Christian Egyptian men who were beheaded on the shores of Libya by ISIS militants. I thought of this because the families of those martyrs publicly forgave the terrorists and are praying for their conversion. We do see this radical forgiveness closer to home, too -- after the Charleston church shooting in 2015, for instance.
There's something about the ritual of executing prisoners in America that is dehumanizing to more than the prisoner who is killed.
Sutton was the 1,156th person executed in the United States since 1976. These state-sanctioned executions are a poison in our law and culture. They insist that more violence and death are good, that they solve a problem. We pretend that they will be a civilizing influence or a deterrent. But I doubt that the next Nick Sutton born of similar circumstances will be swayed by the prospect of the death penalty -- his life is already a living death.
People respond to love. Mercy is for the guilty. We can't look callous in these circumstances, or our arguments about the life of the most innocent might not be heard. I understand why Sutton was not granted clemency, but Sutton's life and death should prompt an examination of conscience that could bring a lot of people of good will -- those strange "pro-life" and "social justice" divides -- together.
Clever response.
Not.
L
Not in the least bit relevant.
It is people like you that are destroying America.
Go to Canada or to France or somewhere your misguided views are acceptable
That a civilized society would allow a person who purposefully takes the life of an innocent person to keep theirs is morally, ethically, judicially and religiously wrong.
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Perfectly stated, and absolutely true! Best post on this thread! KUDOS TO YOU!
God demonstrated forgiveness for sins worthy of death.
Suit yourself.
I note that you don’t argue the veracity, but only object to it not supporting your side of the debate.
So, I suppose it is prudent for us to pick the appropriate Godly approach for the occasion.
“ You are not wise enough to determine what and what is not sinful.”
That’s a stupid statement in general and even more stupid considering the topic of this thread.
Then you go even more stupid in the next statement and completely ignore the fact of our laws origins.
“the death penalty is sinful.”
No, it is not. Why should I be taxed to keep a predator on society alive? Prisons are sinful as they allow those we do not trust to live among us to continue to take from us.
Not a biblically based assertion, but worthy of consideration ... of course an earthquake or other natural disaster can suddenly release into society what should have been put down and let God sort them out. Not to mention the danger to the folks inside guarding these devil’s children.
“Depend upon it, sir, when a man knows he is to be hanged in a fortnight, it concentrates his mind wonderfully.”
― Samuel Johnson, The Life of Samuel Johnson LL.D. Vol 3
The early Americans fled religious persecution that you apparently want to reinstate
Just to clarify: would you say that was morally, ethically, judicially and religiously wrong for God to allow Cain, Moses, David the King, and Saul of Tarsus to keep their lives after having committed murder?
“He deserved to die. Justice demands it.”
Justice in Minnesota does not demand death.
Justice is relative.
Yes, because only the murder victim or, of course, God can forgive the murderer if he admits his crime and asks for forgiveness. As for man, murder (the deliberate taking of an innocent’s life) is the only sin that God commands the sinner shall be put to death, and this requirement appears in each of the first five books of the Bible.
It is if you are a Intractable Pain Patient who can’t be treated..Canada is offering the same drugs that are used for Death Row inmates to Chronically ill patients who need care and use to much resources. Medicare for All is the same thing.
There are no cures for Rapist or Child Rapist why should we feed, house and provide educations and healthcare all out of the victims families pockets? Execute and be done with it.
BINGO!
My friend’s 8 yr old daughter in 1990 was beat, RAPED, strangled unconscious, wrapped in a old blanket tied with her shoe laces, driven to the Wolf River boat dock and thrown in to drown. POS left DNA in her vagina. Why is he still sitting on TN death row? Just waiting for his Decade of Federal appeals. WHERE IS THE JUSTICE FOR NIKKI?
DEATH PENALTY IS ABOUT JUSTICE for HEINOUS CRIMES. AND TREASON.
G-d may determine our relationship to God, that is not and should not be our judgement. Our secular laws are not about convicting FOR G-d. Our laws and any justice in them is secular, period, for our society, not G-d’s. That justice needs to be for society, not G-d. G-d even tells us to obey our secular laws. Sometimes that even means accepting their penalties rather than going against what we know or believe G-d wants us to do. The death penalty is neither against nor for G-d. It is our own secular judgement for a secular result, period. Finally, murder and capital punishment are not, morally, the same thing. The true Aramaic words in the Ten Commandments are “Thou shall not MURDER”, not thou shall not kill. No other meaning can be derived from those words arriving as they did to a society that accepted and imposed capital punishment as lawful to them.
The more and longer we defy God proscription, the more we suffer the sheddung of innocent blood.
If we say it was wrong for God to allow Cain, Moses, David the King, and Saul of Tarsus to keep their lives after having committed murder, then we are accusing God of moral failure, which is impossible.
Nevertheless, in the Torah God did, as you say, command that murderers be put to death; while at the same time, He spares the lives of sinners in the Torah. Cain (who, as primordial murderer, one would think should be the primordial example of life-for-a-life) is specifically put under God's protection, although as far as we know he showed not one bit of regret or repentance, neither out of regard for his brother nor out of respect for God. And Moses, as we know, was regarded as most just and righteous, notwithstanding his act of murder.
Later on, God says He does NOT desire the death of a sinner.
"Have I any pleasure at all that the wicked should die? saith the Lord GOD: and not that he should return from his ways, and live?" (Ezekiel 18:32)And later, almost pleadingly:
"Say unto them, As I live, saith the Lord GOD, I have no pleasure in the death of the wicked; but that the wicked turn from his way and live: turn ye, turn ye from your evil ways; for why will ye die, O house of Israel?" (Ezekiel 33:11)
I reject +Francis' revision of the Catechism, if it is read--- as I think it must be --- as a repudiation of +Benedict's teaching (and all of his predecessors back to Apostolic times!) and a novel declaration that the Death Penalty is inherently and in every case, gravely wrong.
I adhere to +Benedict's Catechism, which allows me to both affirm that the Death Penalty may be just, AND point out that a just application of it, is in practice almost impossible.
In other words, it allows me to say I am not opposed to the Death Penalty in theory, only in practice.
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