Boeing's 737 Max Software Outsourced to $9-an-Hour Engineers [Bloomberg Link Only]

Bloomberg [Link in Body] ^ | Juen 28, 2019 | Peter Robison

[C19fan]

Bloomberg Link

[EVO X]

“Aircrew qualification and training were factors in both 737 MAX accidents. Boeing will do everything it can to convince the accident investigators to list aircrew qualification and training as root cause for both accidents.”

Here is an article from May 15 discussing your comment.

https://www.seattletimes.com/business/boeing-aerospace/how-much-was-pilot-error-a-factor-in-the-boeing-737-max-crashes/

[af_vet_1981]

However, those are not the only two Indian outsourcing firms Boeing uses.

Of course not; it has international relationships to make international sales. However those were the companies Bloomberg and its sources were complaining about and it had nothing to do with the problem in question. Boeing is competing for sales with Airbus. Neither company can survive without international sales of magnitude.

"Sales are another reason to send the work overseas. In exchange for an $11 billion order in 2005 from Air India, Boeing promised to invest $1.7 billion in Indian companies. That was a boon for HCL and other software developers from India, such as Cyient, whose engineers were widely used in computer-services industries but not yet prominent in aerospace."

However this could be related, and it points to American engineers who decided it was not a safety issue: an honest, and expensive mistake.

"Boeing also has disclosed that it learned soon after Max deliveries began in 2017 that a warning light that might have alerted crews to the issue with the sensor wasn’t installed correctly in the flight-display software. A Boeing statement in May, explaining why the company didn’t inform regulators at the time, said engineers had determined it wasn’t a safety issue.

“Senior company leadership,” the statement added, “was not involved in the review.”"

[CodeToad]

“it points to American engineers who decided it was not a safety issue: an honest, and expensive mistake.”

No, it doesn’t. There are no facts that explains who made the decisions, but knowing Boeing, I can assure you that no engineer made the decisions. ALL decisions at Boeing are with the management. The culture at Boeing is “CHAIN OF COMMAND!” Not kidding. Boeing considers management infallible and engineers to be held in distrust. Boeing Ethics is simply a public relations gambit since their CFO went to prison and the 737 Max issues are kicking Boeing’s ass. (Next up, 787 certification issues coming to light!)

Boeing recently hired Satyen Yadav, of Amazon fame, to try to break that ridged 1960’s culture and create a more flexible environment to deliver products faster according to modern protocols. Six months in and rumors are flying that he’s meeting far too much resistance from the old guard to make any effective changes. I would make odds that he won’t make it to the end of the year before he simply resigns in disgust. This is good for Boeing competitors. :)

[af_vet_1981]

1. "engineers had determined it wasn’t a safety issue." -- not managment
2. Given the tenor and purpose of the Bloomberg piece, had they been non-American engineers it would have said so.
3. Some percentage of Boeing engineers are in a union (SPEEA), and that union has the traditional tension with its own interests vs. the company's interests. I think that is probably the source of the article.

[af_vet_1981]

The culture at Boeing is “CHAIN OF COMMAND!” Not kidding. Boeing considers management infallible and engineers to be held in distrust.

Untrue nonsense

[CodeToad]

“”engineers had determined it wasn’t a safety issue.” — not managment”

Uh, no. The engineer are not the ones that make such determinations. I can guarantee you there is a chain of emails with engineers denouncing the decisions to do this. There is currently a whole host of conversations with Boeing engineers bailing within the safety critical cockpit systems so that this doesn’t blow back on them.

This is just like the Challenger disaster whereby management of NASA and Morton tried to throw the engineers under the bus until the memos from the engineers leaked out called for the grounding of the shuttle due to icing concerns.

[CodeToad]

“Untrue nonsense “

Not untrue nonsense. It is one of the reasons Boeing has an engineering union. Think about that. Engineers in a union because management is so bad they need the protection.

[af_vet_1981]

Not untrue nonsense. It is one of the reasons Boeing has an engineering union. Think about that. Engineers in a union because management is so bad they need the protection.

Boeing has an engineering union because of socialist vestiges from the past. The better companies treat all employees, the less support for unions (which tend to put union interests over company interests). Boeing has about 45,000 engineers. SPEEA is comprised of engineers, machinists, and other aerospace factory workers. Their membership is about 23-25k, so perhaps 8-13k are actual engineers.

If the union is that good, they would form a company and try to sell and build (or build and sell) product. Otherwise, they should support their companies and provide value for their membership.