Today’s Conflict Between Fellow Christians Has To Do With Support

I grew up attending a Fundamental, Independent Baptist church, and no, those aren’t capitalized by mistake. That’s because the words “Fundamental” and “Independent” were displayed prominently on our sign, our church bulletin, and anywhere else the church name appeared. It wasn’t just that we were “Baptist,” or even a “church” – because any ragamuffin group of heretics could band together and call themselves a “church” in these United States – no, we wanted the world to know we were “independent” of any top-down control, and we believed we had the “fundamentals” of the Christian faith. Of course, those were the days before “fundamental” began to mean something else entirely, but for us it meant a certain set of theological beliefs and lifestyle legalism, beliefs and practices we were correct on and everyone else was, well, just plain wrong.

In my church, the girls wore culottes, “Hollywood movies” were of the devil, and any form of dancing would lead straight to fire and brimstone. And God help you if you were caught holding hands with your girlfriend in youth group.

That’s some of my church-upbringing story, at least as far as I can remember it, mixed here and there with a bit of hyperbole, just for fun. If you grew up that way too you’ll recognize it, but anyone with any sort of religious upbringing they no longer completely adhere to has their own stories - plenty of good memories, and good people, but plenty also to poke a little fun at when we grow older, hopefully wiser, and more aware of the big world out from beneath our particular steeple.

Churches, denominations, and especially religions themselves tend to be like that to varying degrees - open-minded on some things, closed-minded on others. Some are open to change at every social whim, while others attach themselves to stubborn tradition even as the world proves them wrong time and again. Even the churches in the “middle” understandably have to pick a set of beliefs and try to stick to them, else they might as well be the Lion’s Club and not a church.

Interestingly, the things that divided us along the lines of religion when I was a child in the 80’s don’t divide us so much now. Today, as long as a basic belief in Christ exists, churches typically don’t put down or refuse to associate with other churches or denominations based so much on theological or even lifestyle differences. Oh, there are still “Fundamental, Independent Baptist” churches around (“picking” on those only because they happen to be from my experience), but even many of those have relaxed some of their “standards,” seemingly better understanding that the body of Christ is much bigger than their little corner of it.

After all, the dirty little secret is something many Christians won’t say out loud but know deep down - if the Bible were clear on everything, there wouldn’t be so many denominations, sects, and even cults that genuinely interpret it differently on so many topics. Thankfully, we as Christians have become more humble about our faith, more open, more understanding - tolerant even - and to some degree that’s a good thing. (And no, I don’t mean that in a “leftist” way at all.)

No, it’s no longer theology that primarily drives the conflict between Christians today. It’s something else entirely. Now, the real conflict in America’s churches often boils down to support or rejection of one man, and sadly that man is not Jesus Christ.

Pro-Trump evangelical leaders like Jerry Falwell Jr., Robert Jeffress, and Franklin Graham, men who see the big picture and have chosen to support President Trump despite his flaws, are castigated by anti-Trump Christians as charlatans and fakes, hypocrites who have abandoned their faith and even are preaching “another Gospel” besides Christ’s.

“There is another Gospel in our country right now, and it is the Gospel of Trump,” Red Letter Christians founder Shane Claiborne preached during a protest service near Liberty University last year. “It doesn’t look much like the Gospel of Jesus.”

Clairborne considers the faith proclaimed by Christians who support Trump to be “toxic Christianity,” and he isn’t alone, not by a long shot.

“The moral convictions of many evangelical leaders have become a function of their partisan identification. This is not mere gullibility; it is utter corruption,” wrote former Bush speechwriter and Washington Post columnist Michael Gerson.

Katha Pollitt writes of the “discrediting of evangelical Christianity” as being a “good thing” to come out of Trump’s presidency. “They’ve sold their souls to Donald Trump, who has partaken freely of practically every vice and depravity known to man. Urged on by their leaders, 81 percent of white evangelicals voted for Trump—more than voted for George W. Bush, an actual evangelical—and now everyone is laughing at them. It’s about time.”

Former congresswoman and presidential candidate Michele Bachmann, on the other hand, citing a host of issues from abortion to Israel to religious freedom, stated she has “never seen a more biblical president” than she has “seen in Donald Trump.”

In other words, Donald Trump is either a devil or an angel, depending on which side of the political divide you fall. And although a majority of self-professed Christians do support the president, far too many of the ones who oppose him are quick to condemn the rest of us as somehow unworthy of Christ’s calling. In a weird way, they’ve become more legalistic than any of the legalism the church of my youth could have ever dreamed up.

It’s easy to use religion to justify your political beliefs and we all do it to some extent, especially when it’s possible to literally make the Bible say anything you want. In the end, however, shouldn’t we all agree that God is good and wants good things for his people? Given that, and given the amount of BAD things that happen to people under socialist, communist, totalitarian dictatorships that implement policies today’s leftists advocate, those of us who place God on the side of President Trump and conservatives have a pretty solid case, regardless of that last “bad” thing Trump tweeted or said.

Those who hate Trump try to justify in their tiny minds that Christians who turned out in yuge numbers voted for Trump because we think he is America’s savior. Well, my first support went to Ted Cruz because he is a Christian and his dad’s a pastor who preaches The Bible in what I have heard. And, Ted ran on Christian principles and the Constitution as law of this land. Trump, I was unsure of but he was my second choice after Ted lost his cool in the heat of the primaries.

And, my husband had read some prophesy by Lance Wallnau (sp?) saying that he was showed Trump was going to be God’s choice for President and he’d be a wrecking ball during his years in office. Also, several other prophets predicted this. So, we turned to prayer and fasting and were moved to vote for Trump. I was not sure of his Bible knowledge and study but I did hear some great ways he was moving towards prayer being where he’d lead us with God’s help. And, YES, we hear GOD BLESS AMERICA! We prayed II Chronicles 7:14 for months!!!! I believe with all my heart, mind and soul that God answered prayers and allowed Trump, the under dog, to WIN!!! And, the ministers of God’s Word who support him do so for his platform to bring us back to biblical teachings as the wondering so far away from them in government over the people has us in the pits of sin and financial ruin.

Some think George W. Bush was a solid Bible Christian. He didn’t EVEN KNOW that God and Allah are the difference between God and Satan!!!!!!!! Hello!!!! When he said, “Islam is the religion of peace” days after 9-11-01...I wish these leaders in churches would have debated him on this as many fell into the pit believing what our President said. War and terror came to the world when Satan heard that statement!!! And, Satan won that battle right here in America as mosque didn’t go away but grew in number. REALLY???!!!!

Liberals don’t want real Christianity any more than other government types as they cannot be free thinkers of worldly issues!!!....there is only TWO ways- Good and evil, our choice per GOD!!! They want to be god over us and that is not how GOD designed HIS world!

I got into a pretty heated discussion during a Bible study with a guy who was a very strong anti-abortion activist.

He said he wouldn’t vote for any candidate who’s abortion stance wasn’t as strong as his. (this guy dedicated his life to the cause)

He was also pretty arrogant in upbraiding the rest of us because we didn’t quit our jobs to protest in front of Planned parenthood facilities.

I reminded this guy that the time for absolute electoral purity is the primaries, which in many ways is more important than the general election.

If your pure candidate doesn’t win the primary, then your duty is to vote for the best overall, not stick your fingers in your ears and whine. Oh, did I use the word duty?

My “pure” candidate was Ted Cruz, even though I knew Trump was going to win and was truly the only candidate to destroy Clinton.

Now, the real conflict in America’s churches often boils down to support or rejection of one man, and sadly that man is not Jesus Christ.

The conflict goes back much further than that. This is just the latest chapter.

In this chapter, the split may go deeper, and divide Evangelicals against themselves, rather than against mainstream or liberal denominations, but it may be shallower, more about Trump's behavior and style than about religion or politics.

One could make the counter-argument that everything is about religion and everything is about politics, but in this case there are a lot of people in between, people who support Trump on the issues but don't approve of his behavior or style.

I’m by no means disparaging those still in such churches or any other church, because all have their own unique set of idiosyncrasies, but in my church, if the King James Version was good enough for Paul, it was good enough for us. In my church, the world was created in six days around 6,000 years ago, and any opinion or scientific & historical evidence to the contrary was “denying Scripture.” In my church, the “rapture” could happen at any moment, sweeping us all away while the world burned. Oh, and Jesus turned water into grape juice, of course, because the “devil’s brew” isn’t anything the Son of God would EVER make, much less drink. In my church, the girls wore culottes, “Hollywood movies” were of the devil, and any form of dancing would lead straight to fire and brimstone. And God help you if you were caught holding hands with your girlfriend in youth group. That’s some of my church-upbringing story, at least as far as I can remember it, mixed here and there with a bit of hyperbole, just for fun.

And so apart from the Rapture, grape juice and KJV hyperbole, you became a liberated liberal, denying what the NT church believed about Creation, and how they would class “Hollywood movies,” holding hands with your girlfriend in youth group, and the public baring of the legs of ladies?

If you grew up that way too you’ll recognize it

I was discipled in a FBC for 6 years after leaving Rome, thanks be to God, and will i disagree about the Pentecostal gifts, the time of resurrection of the just, and eternal security, no class of churches I know of had a higher degree of commitment to purity and quality preaching and evangelism of young and old the they.

Which is simply absurd, for we did not vote for Trump as a church pastor, or due to his personal purity, but due to his commitment to policies important to us, and refusal to cower to the liberal politically correct, who are substantially more immoral in their personal and public morality. And as an alternative to a supporter of foundation immorality which was being foisted upon them, and attacking and punishing them for opposing it, and was a friend of those who denigrate them as homophobic, Islamophobic, xenophobic, misogynist hatters who will not submit to the politically correct censoring of the “Left,” and which works to seduce votes with the demonic victim-entitlement mentality in promoting a welfare state which increases reliance upon a ever-growing regulatory government

We have to honestly admit to a large dose of pragmatism on the part of evangelicals voting Trump. The alternative was Hillary, and Christians were willing to overlook 3 marriages, profanity, various forms of unsavory things to avoid another Clinton Obama term. Turns out his policies have been marvelous. The EPA has been reduced by 1/3, people! In 2020 the choice will be starker, as the dem nominee will be a neo Stalinist. Trump it is, warts and all.

"Turns out his policies have been marvelous." Overall. The most conservative since Regan. In response to the question "How can Evangelical Christians justify backing Donald Trump" i responded :

Basically because of policy over person, but as well as the person reusing to be intimidated by liberal political correctness (though often that includes dismissing facts as well). Holding to Biblical values and principals, then faced with a choice btwn a largely conservative candidate versus a very liberal one which denigrates them then it is no surprise they would elect this (or any) Republican.

If evangelicals elected Trump as a church pastor over a one of Scriptural integrity then the charge of them being more loyal to the party than the laws of God would be valid.

Or if evangelicals elected Trump over a Reagan, or if Trump was a supporter of foundation immorality which was being foisted upon them, and attacking and punishing them for opposing it, and was a friend of those who denigrate them as homophobic, Islamophobic, xenophobic, misogynist hatters who will not submit to the politically correct censoring of the “Left,” and which works to seduce votes with the demonic victim-entitlement mentality in promoting a welfare state which increases reliance upon a ever-growing regulatory government - meaning if Trump was a a Hillary - then the charge of inconsistency would have a case.

But instead they elected a man to a office of civil government who more than any other electable candidate overall supports their side in most basic moral issues and conception of government, and refuses to be cowed by the conniving tactics of intimidation of anti-Christ social and socialist revolutionaries. In other words, they are willing to overlook the moral failures (real or alleged) and many unChristian aspects of the temperament and character of the civil leader of the country that they are pilgrims in, because his policies usually align with theirs rather than opposing them. It is kind of like choosing brash captain along with a Chief officer of notable integrity - to sail the ship on a corrective course, a ship which has already been sabotaged by enemies and who chart a course toward shipwreck. In the light of all of this Trump is an answered prayer, and yet who needs our prayers.

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