Posted on 03/20/2019 5:18:38 AM PDT by csvset
JAKARTA/SINGAPORE/PARIS (Reuters) - The pilots of a doomed Lion Air Boeing 737 MAX scoured a handbook as they struggled to understand why the jet was lurching downwards, but ran out of time before it hit the water, three people with knowledge of the cockpit voice recorder contents said
The captain asked the first officer to check the quick reference handbook, which contains checklists for abnormal events, the first source said.
For the next nine minutes, the jet warned pilots it was in a stall and pushed the nose down in response, the report showed. A stall is when the airflow over a plane’s wings is too weak to generate lift and keep it flying.
The captain fought to climb, but the computer, still incorrectly sensing a stall, continued to push the nose down using the plane’s trim system. Normally, trim adjusts an aircraft’s control surfaces to ensure it flies straight and level.
“They didn’t seem to know the trim was moving down,” the third source said. “They thought only about airspeed and altitude. That was the only thing they talked about.”
(Excerpt) Read more at reuters.com ...
Oh, it might be “documented”, doesn’t sound like anyone knew about it or was trained on it, sad.
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A different crew on the same plane the evening before encountered the same problem but solved it after running through three checklists, according to the November report.
But they did not pass on all of the information about the problems they encountered to the next crew, the report said.
Why not document and pass along the info ?
Sure sounds like Boeing built one really crappy airplane.
200 hours of flight experience. Equivalent to 5 weeks.
Maybe they should have given him another couple days before putting the lives of hundreds in his hands.
A very worthwhile thing to check is to see what reports,if any,have been filed on this plane by pilots flying for First World airlines.Seems to me that if there were any we would have heard about it by now.
Having flown Third World airlines more times that I care to admit I refuse,at *this* point,to rule out something connected to pilot stupidity or inability to read English.
“They didn’t seem to know the trim was moving down,” the third source said. “They thought only about airspeed and altitude. That was the only thing they talked about.”
...
And that’s why they crashed. All they had to do was disable the automatic trim.
“The manufacturer has said there is a documented procedure to handle the situation.”
Too bad it wasn’t in the quick reference book.
L
More like they modified an airframe beyond its safe zone.
A different crew on the same plane the evening before encountered the same problem but solved it after running through three checklists, according to the November report.
But they did not pass on all of the information about the problems they encountered to the next crew, the report said.
Why not document and pass along the info ?
...
Bad pilots and bad airline. Such problems must be logged.
I’m in IT and have worked with the guys that babysit the mainframe processing all night, calling us programmers when a job failed, etc.
When one guy leaves a shift, he passes on the notes from the previous shift, listing all activity for that shift. We did it that way in the 1980’s for crying out loud.
That crew should have had the same knowledge the crew before them had. This is a breakdown/flaw in that airline’s procedures.
It doesn’t mean Boeing is off the hook, but it looks like it really was a case of “pilot error” to some degree, if only because a different pilot had the same thing happen but the plane didn’t crash.
Computers are too heavily relied upon in aviation.
Maybe I’m missing something. Were they trying to fly via autopilot or hand flying the aircraft? I flew 4 engine transports for awhile. If we had runaway pitch trim, we disconnected the autopilot, and disconnected both the electric and electro-hydraulic trim inputs. Viola. And you fly the aircraft and don’t crash. There must be more to this. I just don’t get it.
It’s called Pilot 101. “Fly the Airplane!” You don’t need a manual to know to disconnect the stab trim.
-——The manufacturer has said there is a documented procedure to handle the situation.-—
How long have you been a pilot?
A few years ago we flew an Emirates A380 that was being piloted by an Aussie.We had seats right near the little stairway that leads to the cockpit so I was able to see the pilot come aboard (we boarded early).
Hearing that he spoke English I smiled and said to him "hey,any chance of me taking the wheel for a little while?" He laughed and said "no...there's a three day course you've gotta take before you can fly one of these".
Hope that book is easier to read than my Jeep owners manual.......
My sentiments as well. Again, what am I missing here?
As the 31-year-old captain tried in vain to find the right procedure in the handbook, the 41-year-old first officer was unable to control the plane, two of the sources said.
Slideshow (2 Images)
The flight data recorder shows the final control column inputs from the first officer were weaker than the ones made earlier by the captain.
...
First of all, the captain should have disabled the automatic trim. His second mistake was letting the first officer fly them into the ground. Also the first officer should have let the captain know that he couldn’t control the plane.
Read the threads on FR if you want to find them. Or google. Or continue to do what you are doing.
They touted the 737 Max 8 as “just another 737” so they could use as a selling point the fact it required no significant pilot retraining for current 737 pilots.
Boing is going to be HAMMERED in lawsuits. HAMMERED.
“Hope that book is easier to read than my Jeep owners manual.......”
We’ve owned a Hyundai for over 2 years and we are still finding things out.
200 hours.... what we’re they thinking?
L
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