Posted on 03/11/2019 1:07:59 PM PDT by Magnatron
The Boeing 737 MAX, the type of plane involved in a deadly crash in Ethiopia over the weekend, is still airworthy and the Federal Aviation Administration plans to issue a notice to the international aviation community later Monday, a person familiar with the matter said.
"The FAA continuously assesses and oversees the safety performance of U.S. commercial aircraft," the FAA said in a statement. "If we identify an issue that affects safety, the FAA will take immediate and appropriate action."
Aviation officials in China and Indonesia ordered domestic airlines to ground their fleets of the popular Boeing single-aisle planes after the deadly crash of one operated by Ethiopian Airlines on Sunday. The 149 passengers and eight crew members on board were killed when the plane crashed shortly after takeoff.
The incident was the second deadly crash of the new Boeing planes in less than five months. A Lion Air Boeing 737 MAX 8 plunged into the Java Sea shortly after taking off from Jakarta in October, killing all 189 people on board.
(Excerpt) Read more at cnbc.com ...
would you count “smoking” as evidence to the contrary?
I did two flights last week on some type of 737 and came back fine. Not gonna worry about a US airline with Navy and Air Force trained pilots up front like Sully.
If the latest one was dropping debris and smoke before crashing it is a different situation. Maybe a bomb.
Without saying too much, most of you are guessing or are flat out wrong. I am a 737 Pilot and have flown the Max. It flies fine. Nice and quiet and super fuel efficient.
There was US bomber commander in WWII Europe whose unit was ordered to attack a German installation from six thousand feet. The Germans had massive AA batteries to protect it. The pilot told the originating officer that attacking that low was suicide.
When the OC said he should do it anyway, the bomber pilot said he’d be happy to lead the flight if the OC sat co-pilot.
The mission was scrubbed and the OC decided to court martial the bomber commander, Paul Tibbets. General Doolittle told Tibbets the General couldn’t stop the court-martial but he could get Tibbets transferred out before the court could convene.
And that’s what Doolittle did. Tibbets transferred stateside and eventually flew the plane named after his aunt, Enola Gay, to drop an a-bomb on Japan.
Without saying too much,
I have 7 flight on southwest this week. Haven’t even looked which plane. I’m not worried. There is abig difference between US pilots and their overseas counterparts
No US Airlines, we test ours.
May not isn’t good enough when two of the exact same model, the most new and most modified, go down in the exact same manner inside of a few months.
It is either a flaw with the software, or a feature of the software that has not been properly communicated to the carriers flying these jets.
Either way, “may not” isn’t good enough. The program is binary, it’s either right, or it isn’t. There needs to be some definitive answers. If it’s purely operator, then Boeing better lay out the case. Quickly. Nobody wants to spend the first 15 minutes of their flight wondering if it is going to go out of control with a pilot who hasn’t got proper factory emergency procedures for when the maneuvering characteristics augmentation system goes buggy.
The problem with that is the amount of time they have to recognize the problem and take action -- all while the plane is pitching nose down and the pilot is pulling up frantically to correct. The Lion Air flight went down 13 minutes into the flight, and the Ethiopian flight went down in only six. Both malfunctions came on suddenly at the end of those timelines, and the pilots had very little time to react.
To make matters worse, pilots were not properly trained on how to react to this problem. Jon Weaks, president of the Southwest Airlines Pilot Association said that the pilots “were kept in the dark.” He also said “We do not like the fact that a new system was put on the aircraft and wasn’t disclosed to anyone or put in the manuals.” The move from the older 737 NG model cockpit to the new 737 Max system consisted of little more than a one-hour session on an iPad, according to Dennis Tajer, the spokesman for the APA. United Airlines, a buyer of the MAX, doesn’t even have simulators specific to the MAX model.
Training issue or not, there is something inherently wrong with this aircraft. It has a natural tendency to pitch up, due to the repositioning of the engine nacelles from the previous model. Compound that with a faulty sensor telling the MCAS that it needs to move the nose down, the pilots suddenly finds their self fighting the plane's actions. With only seconds to react -- and with panic setting in -- that one hour training on the iPad doesn't give them enough info to make a critical decision.
These planes need to be grounded all over until a definitive answer can be discovered, and proper training initiated on MAX-specific simulators. We have too many of these flying right now to take a risk otherwise.
“It said the flight tracker only showed one drop in altitude but that drop would have been close to surface elevation”
No, flight tracker shows 4 drastic drops in the last minute. 4 down, and 4 just as hard up, each change greater than the last.
You can train an A&P to do almost all of a pilot’s job in 2 or 3 weeks. You can train a pilot to do an A&Ps job in 2 to 3 years.
So there’s that.
“as the major airlines using this system do not have MAX simulators available to train on”
Trusimulation has built and installed 737 Max sims for Boeing in Boeing’s training facility in Miami.
Correct. Every single pilot at my Airline has tremendous experience. Decades worth. I personally have over 17,000 hours and have flown dozens of different airplanes. Most of those hours have been in various jets. A large percentage of us have extensive military jet experience as well including Aircraft commander and a few test pilots too. We have 1 Space Shuttle Commander. The airline system in some other parts of the World is not as well developed or structured. And, there is way less collective experience in general. Europe and East Asia is first rate but some other places not so much. In fact, lots of Foreign Airlines seek out western trained pilots. (they prefer people from English Speaking countries). Americans, Canadians, Brits, Aussies, New Zealanders, etc.. Most large carriers have them. Emirates Airline has almost all exclusively ex-pats. And there’s a lot of us in the Far East as well at ANA, Cathay Pacific, JAL, etc..
I should have clarified. The lack of simulators at the carrier training facilities were noted after the Lion Air crash. Since then American, Delta, and Southwest have installed several.
There are thousands of pilots, though, that would need to go through these simulators -- and they would need specific simulation routines run on this particular problem. I'd be curious to know how many have been sim-trained to react the MCAS issue. I'd be willing to bet that it's not all of them, or even a majority.
BUT...
How much of that is stick time? (Commercial, not counting military).
That is where the disconnect lies with today's technology. Flight hours need to be examined differently than in the past. With a fully automated cockpit, pilots' stick time has been limited mostly to threshold-to-landing, and initial takeoff.
Check your facts, Ethiopia is a majority (62%) Coptic Christian country, and has been for centuries.
Ethiopia is a majority (62%) Coptic Christian country, and has been for centuries.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.