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To: nickcarraway
The Holocaust has unfortunately suffered the inception of a cottage industry of expanded accusations. At the end of WW2, the allies found that the Wehrmacht was largely innocent of war crimes. Suddenly in the '90s, just most of those involved were conveniently dying off, all kinds of "new research" exploded onto the scene, articles and studies with such titles as "the myth of the clean Wehrmacht" and so forth.

This is the same kind of thing. The Poles, who after the Jews probably suffered more than any group during WW2, are suddenly, conveniently found to have been "the bad guys" after all. Was there antisemitism and collaboration in Poland? Absolutely, just as some members of the German army committed war crimes. But not at all to the level that is suddenly the dernier cri to claim.

8 posted on 02/25/2018 7:36:47 PM PST by Wyrd bið ful aræd (Flag burners can go screw -- I'm mighty PROUD of that ragged old flag)
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To: Wyrd bið ful aræd

“the allies found that the Wehrmacht was largely innocent of war crimes”............................ Hmmmmm? Maybe not the mass murders, but I am sure they killed Jews, because a lot of the Russian partisans and their supporters were Jewish. The Wehrmacht had anti partisan units that were made up of volunteers from Belorussia, Ukraine, Latvia,Estonia, and Lithuania. (I’m sure the SS had them too,for other than anti partisan units.) Most eastern volunteers were deployed to protect the lines of communications, hence the anti partisan units. (Yeah, they probably also had a few disgruntled Cossacks in Wehrmacht uniforms.)


33 posted on 02/26/2018 8:52:43 AM PST by Bringbackthedraft (Damn Cursor did it again?)
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To: Wyrd bið ful aræd
The Holocaust has unfortunately suffered the inception of a cottage industry of expanded accusations. At the end of WW2, the allies found that the Wehrmacht was largely innocent of war crimes. Suddenly in the '90s, just most of those involved were conveniently dying off, all kinds of "new research" exploded onto the scene, articles and studies with such titles as "the myth of the clean Wehrmacht" and so forth.
Really bad example. The Western Allies had every reason to try to protect the Wehrmacht after the war because of the Soviet threat. More importantly, most instances of the WEhrmacht participating the Holocaust occured in Poland, the Soviet-occupied Baltic nations, and USSR. The SS Special Action Squads (Einsatzgruppen) recieved considerable Wehrmacht help in rounding up Jews, communists, Catholic priests, Polish leaders, and other undesirables in the invasion of Poland and then in the invasion of the USSR.


This is the same kind of thing. The Poles, who after the Jews probably suffered more than any group during WW2, are suddenly, conveniently found to have been "the bad guys" after all. Was there antisemitism and collaboration in Poland? Absolutely, just as some members of the German army committed war crimes. But not at all to the level that is suddenly the dernier cri to claim.
This isn't suddenly. Jews were speaking of Polish collusion and antisemitic violence from 1945 onwards. Poland never colluded. Polish citizens, including some resistance members, did collude by selling out or simply selling Jews to the Nazis. In some occasions Jewish partisans were captured and sold to the Ukrainian militia by Polish partisans. My father had first hand experience. Actually others did, he was the only one to survive. Many Polish partisans considered Jews to be as much an enemy as Nazis and Soviets. Other Poles hated the Nazis, but sold Jews out to settle old feuds. Others simply stole the property of Jews, who were rounded up by the Nazis. And thousands of Jews were murdered from 1944-46 by Poles as they returned to their homes. At the same time, 750,000 ethnic Poles were killed in the Holocaust and up to 100,000 Jews survived with the help of Poles. Thousands of the Poles killed by the Nazis were sent to concentration camps for helping Jews. The picture is complex. I consider the term "Polish concentration camp" to be so misleading as to border on Holocaust denial. But it is a mistake to downplay the effects of Polish antisemitism.

39 posted on 02/26/2018 5:28:56 PM PST by rmlew ("Mosques are our barracks, minarets our bayonets, domes our helmets, the believers our soldiers.")
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To: Wyrd bið ful aræd

“But not at all to the level that is suddenly the dernier cri to claim. “ — exactly. And actually the one group that suffered more than Jews were gypsies who were treated worse (boggles the mind, right?) in Auschwizt.


53 posted on 03/19/2018 2:37:24 AM PDT by Cronos (Obama's dislike of Assad is not based on his brutality but that he isn't a jihadi Moslem)
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