Yes I did completely fail on your point, it appears you have failed to respond to anything I have said too though. Why would I respond? When your very first couple of sentences are headed at breakneck speed off into some hinterland that has nothing to do with what I said, why would I even read the rest of your post?
I arrive at my opinions based on a variety of sources. I consult the medical literature directly for matters regarding the effects (short and long term) of marijuana use. For the societal effects, I draw from both personal experience and a variety of documented sources (which are not always in the medical literature).
But with technological advances, it became possible for some people to become addicts who are incapable of performing meaningful work and yet society makes sure they don't die.
Can anybody else enlighten me on her point? Is it just me??
I do happen to know that there are a number of other FReepers who are aware of the role of technological advances in enabling a whole class of people who leech off of other people. I had no way of knowing that you are not one of those.
Technological advances mean that the basic needs of human life--food, shelter, and clothing--can be produced with a fraction of the labor that it took to produce them prior to the industrial revolution. Thus, in historical times, society could not afford to support a large number of people who did not pull their own weight. Now, however, with our basic needs met with far less labor, it is possible to confiscate enough from workers to support a sizeable non-working class. Drug addicts fall directly into that non-working class, especially as they sink deeper into their addictions.
Even with the decreased quantity of labor needed to ensure that basic living needs are met, there is still a limit on how many freeloaders that society can support. I do not think that the experiment with turning large numbers of people into potheads is going to end well, in part because of that limit.
I have known a few of those sort of addicts over the years (incapable or simply unwilling to do any sort of meaningful work) and it was NOT marijuana they were addicted too... It was crack, speed, heroin and even alcohol... all the "man made" crap that destroys lives. Also known a few of them that were dead before 40 that somehow society did not manage to save... so yeah your point is lost on me.
They were addicts who used a variety of substances to get their "highs." Marijuana certainly feeds into that.
Marijuana has been classified as a "gateway" drug. I do not know how strong the evidence is, but the concept of marijuana as a gateway drug does fit the model of drug addiction. In the general model, people try something and get a high. They like the feeling, so try to repeat it. However, the more they use, the more their body builds up resistances to the substance.
The scientific explanation is that many mind-altering substances act very specifically to interfere with the functions of neuroreceptors. One way the body compensates is to synthesize more receptors, because the body is trying to maintain the normal physiological function of those receptors which is impaired when those receptors are blocked by non-physiological substances. Thus, it takes higher doses of the substance to produce the same effects. There is a limit on how many extra receptors the body can synthesize, so eventually, even high doses cannot overcome the body's defenses and produce the effect.
When the first drug of choice fails to produce the desired high, people then look for something else to try to get that high. They want stronger drugs, or different drugs that have a slightly different mechanism of action to cause mind-altering effects. Marijuana acts on a different class of neuroreceptors than opioids; thus, people looking for something that will produce the "high" that they crave would quite naturally turn from the use of one class of drugs to the other class.
And yes, drug addicts do die of their addictions, not because they overwhelmed society's ability to provide for their basic needs, but because they damaged their bodies to the point of no longer being capable of supporting life. The fact is that society, through government provided health care, goes to extraordinary measures to try to save drug addicts from their self-induced medical issues. If it was up to me, I would just let their addictions kill them.
Thanks for responding so maybe we could have a conversation about this
Why would I respond? ..... why would I even read the rest of your post?
My question about that was twofold, not just this, but more so a reference to the last thread about opioids where I was still a little bent about your minimizing response and then non response... all I can say beyond the anecdotal evidence I provided in that thread that you ignored, is it must be nice to not have a clue what dealing with chronic pain is like. I have had back pain since my teen years, my mom would come in and ask why I was sleeping on the floor.
As far as where you say your opinions have been formed, to have a real conversation, I would have to know how you feel about a couple other legal drugs that are proven to cause harm and kill thousands of Americans every year and let me know if you are or were a cigarette smoker or drink any form of alcohol. Personally I would put Marijuana in the classification of another legal harmless drug that also comes from a plant... called Caffine... Are you a coffee drinker?? I am not, lets ban that too! /sarc
Marijuana has been classified as a "gateway" drug. I do not know how strong the evidence is, but the concept of marijuana as a gateway drug does fit the model of drug addiction.
I am fairly sure for some people that try marijuana first, it would be considered a gateway drug because they moved on and tried something else... but that said, nothing else I know of is even relative in the high it produces. That high is similar to the relaxation somebody feels from drinking a couple beers, or climbing in a hot bath and relaxing... beyond that, its a feeling in your eyes like you are tired. It is not a upward high unless the Marijuana is a sativa strain, then its more like drinking a few cups of coffee.
All I really know to do is tell you my story... Personally Alcohol was my gateway drug growing up in rural Oregon, but then we moved to yuppie northern California, Marin County to be exact, and they did not even do weed, those parties were beer and cocaine in the mid 80s... Weed just mellowed out that high... I tried it wanting to fit in, but that shit was not for me. I did try MJ at some point and again not for me, it was nothing... I got a better headrush taking a dip of Kodiak chewing tobacco and I sure loved beer! Somebody had a keg party every weekend... I graduated high school and the following weekend my dad drove me to Phoenix to start tech school to learn drafting, 10 days after graduating. Wow how lucky for me, Arizona's drinking age was 18... Dad left and I walked to the store, bought a dozen eggs and a 12 pack of beer... That got me to
this point real quick. During that month (did you follow the link?) I smoked in a few social situations instead of drinking. At some point in the future I realized when I smoked, I did not notice my back pain, like after I sneezed it out of place and was in bed for 3 or 4 days... It really showed when I went away and did not travel with weed, and could not bend over or walk by the time we got home... 20 years ago, my wife and I both believed I would be in a wheel chair by the time I was 40... The only thing I have ever been to the doctor for since I got out of school was stitches once, kidney stones once and a carpel tunnel test after 25 years using a mouse 8-16 hours a day. I have had the same drafting career my whole life, worked for three different employers besides being self employed the past few years. I averaged a dollar an hour raise every year of my career until things collapsed in 2008... not sure how much evidence you need that weed does not have to be what you think it is, none of the people I deal with on a daily basis ever have a clue I used marijuana. When things collapsed in 2008, I needed that income level and worked foreclosure cleanouts 80-100 hours a week to make ends meet until I could reduce my debt, then that ended and my wife and I scraped by on about 10K a year doing literally anything I could do legally to make money, drawing provided most of my work the last couple years, until last year when I magically got busy again. So for a few years there, we had no money to spend on marijuana... I did not go rob people to buy it, we went without... I got to the point where I could barely bend over and tie my shoes when somebody recommended I try CBD oil... That was the key... It somehow acts as a lubrication in my joints (the ones between my bones that is) and now that is what I use mostly. I did get my card when Arizona legalized medically a few years ago and at the time we could grow it ourselves because there were no dispensaries... So I grew it and really enjoyed that as a hobby and I started smoking again, then they took grow rights away and you had to go pay $400/oz to buy it, so back to the CBD. I missed growing it more than smoking it honestly... If the feds would get out of the way, I would quit drawing and go into that industry and quit drawing... If I work more than 8 hours a day, my arm aches really bad, if I continue working like that the pain will go all the way down my leg and I cant even hardly walk a week later... I found a tens unit on my arm when the pain starts up will allow me to work. I would much rather be a simple farmer.