Posted on 05/25/2017 9:16:30 AM PDT by Kaslin
Trusting Saudi Arabia to combat terrorists and extremists and "drive them out," as President Trump called on the kingdom and other Arab and Muslim nations to do in his Riyadh speech, is akin to forging an alliance with the Ku Klux Klan to combat racism and anti-Semitism. Saudi Arabia has for years promoted the very evil they now "commit" to fighting through a newly established Global Center for Combating Extremist Ideology. Never forget that 15 of the 9-11 hijackers were citizens of Saudi Arabia.
President Trump's speech was written by Westerners, delivered by a westerner and based on a faulty western premise, namely, that radical Muslims can be persuaded to abandon their goal of establishing a worldwide caliphate. It is a central theological principle of Wahhabism, an austere form of Islam based on a literal interpretation of the Koran, which Saudi Arabia has for years promoted in children's textbooks, in mosques and through its media.
No reporter asked the central question that should have been put to Saudi Foreign Minister Adel al-Jubeir during his press availability with Secretary of State Rex Tillerson: Since Saudi Arabia's domestic and foreign policy is based on a theological worldview, have those views changed and if so, how did that "revelation" come to you?
One indication the Saudis might be engaging in duplicity that is common practice throughout the Middle East comes in a Washington Post story. The Saudis, the newspaper says, helped block a Trump administration proposal to impose sanctions against a Saudi branch of ISIS: "The plan to add the Islamic State's Saudi affiliate to a U.N. list of terrorist groups was quietly killed two weeks ago in a bureaucratic maneuver at the U.N. Security Council, records show. U.S. officials familiar with the move said the Saudis objected to the public acknowledgement of the existence of a separate Saudi offshoot of the terrorist group inside the kingdom."
Here, a definition of duplicity may be helpful: "Deceitfulness in speech or conduct, as by speaking or acting in two different ways to different people concerning the same matter." Arab and Muslim leaders have long said one thing to the West and the opposite to their own people. This is not "breaking news." The surprise is that Westerners continue to fall for it.
President Trump's speech was well delivered and he got some economic benefits from Saudi Arabia by signing a nearly $110 billion arms deal, effective immediately, plus another $350 billion over the next 10 years, which the president said would create thousands of new American jobs. All of that is good, but Saudi Arabia will stop promoting an ideology that encourages terrorism only if their god cancels the order for establishing a worldwide caliphate, the elimination of Israel and the vilification of Jews. This is what the secular West under several administrations has failed to grasp.
A policy forged in theology is not about to be changed by the urging of "infidels."
Saudi Foreign Minister Jubeir also said, "If we can change the conversation in the Islamic world from enmity towards the U.S. to partnership with the U.S., and if we can change the conversation in the U.S. and in the West from enmity towards the Islamic world to one of partnership, we will have changed our world and we will have truly drowned the voices of extremism and we will have drained the swamps ... from which extremism and terrorism emanates."
It is an interesting metaphor in a desert land.
Speaking of Iran and its recent election, Jubeir said, "From our perspective, we judge Iran by its actions, not by its words."
That's a suitable standard by which to judge the words of Saudi leaders. Without a change in their theological worldview, however, I'm not buying it
Is there a single member of Congress or a president willing to take on Saudi Arabia? They are a vile, dangerous, evil country/kingdom & yet we just keep doing whatever they want us to do.
Dealing with Saudi Arabia is much like it used be dealing with the Soviet Union.
Reagan did it by “trust but verify”.
The Arabians INVENTED “taqiyya” or “kitman”. The Saudi family takes full advantage of this tradition.
While I agree with much of what Cal said, I doubt that Trump is the trusting dolt that Cal seems to want to portray him as - he’s leveraging energy and a commitment to fight terror to force their hand. He also knows that the newer regime has been “westernized” to some extent and will continue the pressure. God help them if the weapons deals end up being used to help terrorists....
“Deceitfulness in speech or conduct, as by speaking or acting in two different ways to different people concerning the same matter.”
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This is part of their religion as much as killing infidels and slavery.
Islam cannot be reformed.
The Saudis epitomize the Arab cultural attitude toward lying - that it is just a reasonable tactic for getting a good price or other benefit - a normal part of everyday speech. If you’re not lying, you’re not trying, they might say, if they were frank about it.
They have built the legitimacy of their economically rapacious absolute dictatorship on the basis of a religious imperative (and brute force coupled with a world-class police state).
For them to burn the jihadi teachings within the Wahabbi establishment, would be a difficult and dangerous undertaking (King Faisal was assassinated by a devout family member, for allowing TV into the Kingdom).
If it is ever going to happen, now is one of the best opportunities. We are no longer hostage to oil prices - they are. The Saudi budget is gushing red ink, due to American shale oil production. Their domestic economy has ground to a recessionary halt. They face an existential threat from Iran, which is on the verge of getting nuclear weapons, and has military forces surrounding the Kingdom in Iraq, Syria and Yemen (which fires rockets into Saudi Arabia).
Only the US can effectively defend the Saudis from Iran, and is also their best bet for re-booting the Saudi economy.
The Saudis are the center of gravity in the whole struggle against Sunni extremism (al Queda, ISIS, Boko Haram, Hamas, Muslim Brotherhood, al Shabab, CAIR, etc.).
All the arms sales can be suspended, if the Saudis fail to follow through - it takes an administration willing to squeeze them hard, and hold their feet to fire. It will be very hard for the Saudis to change their doctrine.
That's the key. Before the entire world, Trump told them what was expected. When they try their usual obfuscations and lies they'll get called out on it. Let the squeezing begin.
That's enough. Trump doesn't care if they keep their cultures, religions, or 'ways'... Trump cares about Americans. Period.
The reason the gathering for Trump included over 50 Muslim countries was because the Muslim world knows they're losing respect and power all over the world... and that if the loss continues at this rate their cultures and power will be destroyed.
They have skin in the game. They know Trump stated the loss and they know Trump can stop it.
It's why the Muslim world showed up in force. And Trump's made them a fair offer: control their losers - put their rabid dogs down - or face the wrath of the world. A wrath that will steal their prestige, money, and power...and Muslim leaders care about their power... Real power to these Muslim leaders matters more than the Koran's mythical caliphate...
“....faulty western premise, namely, that radical Muslims can be persuaded to abandon their goal of establishing a worldwide caliphate...”
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That’s the whole crux of the matter. The West still awaits the muslim response to Trump’s speech
I am not too optimistic — I think that the Manchester bombing may be one of their responses. It is easier to deliver the response in Europe than in the US.
>>We have ONE common interest with the Sauds and the Muslim World - to destroy ISIS and AlQuada...<<
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I don’t even think that we have ONE common interest. Another 9/11 is still possible.
I’m curious WTF is all that aircraft and arms the Saudis buy for? Can they actually fly those fighters? And which country exactly would they even use them against?
This WAS NOT A SMALL GATHERING... and some of the countries that showed up are not exactly 'friends'... They have 'interests' and so do we... the point those interest cross is the death of ISIS and AlQaeda.
Please explain your position 353RMG...
I don't understand where you're coming from. 9-11 wasn't done by the ruling insiders of Saudi Arabia it was financed by the families of their wealthy outcasts... The Bin Laden types... more money than brains or power... That group has to be dealt with too... but that's NOT our problem. That's the problem of the House of Saud. We have to start somewhere to reel in this evil and it's easier to do with the help of 50+ Muslim Nations than without them. That's my take. How can you disagree?
This WAS NOT A SMALL GATHERING... and some of the countries that showed up are not exactly 'friends'... They have 'interests' and so do we... the point OUR interest crosses with theirs is the death of ISIS and AlQaeda.
Please explain your position 353RMG...
I don't understand where you're coming from. 9-11 wasn't done by the ruling insiders of Saudi Arabia it was financed by the families of their wealthy outcasts... The Bin Laden types... more money than brains or power... That group has to be dealt with too... but that's NOT our problem. That's the problem of the House of Saud. We have to start somewhere to reel in this evil and it's easier to do with the help of 50+ Muslim Nations than without them. That's my take. How can you disagree?
My position is based on the fact that, even after a week of Trump’s speech, we have not received a response from the Muslim world. I don’t think they foresaw the speech, they are flabbergasted and do not know how to respond which really is an indication that they are not in agreement with the contents of the speech. Trump should await the COMBINED response of all 50+ Muslim heads of state — a single response from Saudi would be disappointing to say the least.
LOL
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