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To: DoughtyOne

I see heroism in his refusing to be released from the Hanoi Hilton for propaganda purposes while other soldiers were still being held. His political career on the other hand has been terrible and I think that he has much blood on his hands for the arming of ISIS in the middle east.


23 posted on 07/20/2015 5:28:43 PM PDT by dschapin
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To: dschapin; All

There is no doubt John McCain suffered greatly as a POW inside the Hanoi Hilton. But he has allowed a myth to remain in existence regarding his ‘heroism’.

Admiral Stockdale ordered all POWs in the Hanoi Hilton to refuse any offers of early release. There is no doubt McCain was merely following orders when he refused an early release offer by the Communists. To his credit he obeyed the order but obeying orders does not translate to heroism, it translates to doing one’s duty.

McCain has certainly allowed the perception to persist that he chose to refuse early release out of his own sense of devotion to the other men and his personal integrity. Hence his alleged heroism. He never disavowed or corrected this perception or said, to my knowledge, that he was following an order from Stockdale.

AGAIN, He never disavowed or corrected this perception or said, to my knowledge, that he was following an order from Stockdale.


44 posted on 07/20/2015 5:39:47 PM PDT by true believer forever (Lord, Give me this mountain.)
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To: dschapin

Do you realize he was following the orders of Stockdale when he refused to leave early? He couldn’t have left against the orders of his superior officer.

I didn’t know that until recently. Here again, he allowed the public to think it was all up to him for decades.

Are you aware the Pentagon refused to give John his promotions that POWs normally get?

Are you aware he made at least 30 and possibly as many as 38 propaganda films for the NVC?

Are you aware that he did an interview and stated himself that he made an arrangement with the NVC to give them top secrets for preferential treatment?

When training to fly aircraft, John didn’t apply himself. He flew one aircraft into the bay. He lost another one hot dogging. He last three more including the one he was shot down in. This qualified him as a reverse ACE.

Are you aware he revealed the delivery routes of our aircraft into Vietnam? Are you aware a number our pilots died shortly after that? Are you aware our operations were adversely affected?

Was he shot down because he didn’t apply himself in training? It’s a very real possibility.

He’s trainer stated that he knows for a fact he was only demanded to do several deck landings when the official demand is double or more what John was required to do, to be certified.

He should not have even been in the flight school. He graduated 894th out of 899 in his class, and would not have qualified for flight school based on that.

None the less he was appointed to flight school before all but two of his 900 classmates.

Did you know that John McCain fought veterans groups and the families of our men MIA in Vietnam. He with others classified information about our POWs so the families could not get it. He denied there are 1500 POWs left in Vietnam stating only about 475 were. The families requested information on the 475, and McCain said they’d have it after the Senate Select Committee was done.

They never got it.

He treated those families and their representatives terribly.

How does all this sit with you, as you contemplate McCain being a war hero?


57 posted on 07/20/2015 5:46:42 PM PDT by DoughtyOne (Conservatism: Now home to liars too. And we'll support them. Yea... GOPe)
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To: dschapin

“I see heroism in his refusing to be released from the Hanoi Hilton for propaganda purposes while other soldiers were still being held.”

Untrue. He was ordered not to leave by Adm. Stockdale and the reason was he said ‘we all go home together’. So McCain had to stay.

This came out of a book he wrote in 1984 I believe.


58 posted on 07/20/2015 5:46:49 PM PDT by Paulie (America without Christianity is like a Chemistry book without the periodic table.)
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To: dschapin
Was McLame "heroic", when the very FIRST thing he said, when found by the Viet Cong was : "MY FATHER IS AN ADMIRAL AND SO IS MY GRANDFATHER!" ?

Do you even know that he was not shot down, but crashed yet another plane; only the last time,m was in enemy country?

69 posted on 07/20/2015 5:54:38 PM PDT by nopardons
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