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1 posted on 01/20/2014 2:04:50 PM PST by Welchie25
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To: Welchie25

Lest there be any misunderstanding: These Bishops are NOT speaking Ex Cathedra. Their understanding of economics is on a par with Barack Al-Obama’s.


2 posted on 01/20/2014 2:08:50 PM PST by 2harddrive
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To: Welchie25

The Church agrees private property is the best to allocate and distribute resources. But it also teaches Christians must give to someone in need. One must always serve God, not Mammon. We can afford to pay who those work for a living a wage sufficient to support themselves and their families. Its really about priorities.


5 posted on 01/20/2014 2:11:41 PM PST by goldstategop (In Memory Of A Dearly Beloved Friend Who Lives In My Heart Forever)
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To: Welchie25
1. The church’s call for a living wage is nothing new.
2. Minimum wage is not a living wage.
3. Wages aren’t the only place where the workplace should improve.
4. The local Catholic Church sees the effects of poverty up close.
5. Pope Francis is on board.

6. There's a Presbyterian church right down the road, if you don't like socialism.

6 posted on 01/20/2014 2:12:59 PM PST by Alex Murphy ("the defacto Leader of the FR Calvinist Protestant Brigades")
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To: Welchie25

American bishops flap their lips as the churches of the new catholic religion empty.

Capitalism is bad, saith the new pope as America turns itself inside out to accommodate socialism. Satan is winning and God is not pleased.

No souls are being saved, but slaves to socialism are being shackled together.


8 posted on 01/20/2014 2:15:32 PM PST by IbJensen (Liberals are like Slinkies, good for nothing, but you smile as you push them down the stairs.)
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To: Welchie25

Economic insanity continues to spread unabated. We continue to abandon a system that made us the strongest and richest country in history in favor of a failed system that cannot work.


12 posted on 01/20/2014 2:43:23 PM PST by Brooklyn Attitude (Things are only going to get worse.)
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To: Welchie25

Money isn’t everything, you know.


15 posted on 01/20/2014 2:54:31 PM PST by jdsteel (Give me freedom, not more government.)
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To: Welchie25

A wage sufficient to support a family I put at $75,000/yr. minimum with a 5 or 10 percent increase yearly. Sounds good to me!


17 posted on 01/20/2014 2:57:41 PM PST by count-your-change (you don't have to be brilliant, not being stupid is enough)
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To: Welchie25

What’s the Bishops take on the Parable of the Talents, Matthew 25:14-30? God punished the guy with 1 talent who didn’t grow it in the capitalist system. The opposit of Social Justice.


22 posted on 01/20/2014 4:37:48 PM PST by RginTN
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To: Welchie25; Abundy; Albion Wilde; AlwaysFree; AnnaSASsyFR; bayliving; BFM; Bigg Red; ...

Faith-based socialism?

Maryland “Freak State” PING!


23 posted on 01/21/2014 8:03:54 PM PST by Tolerance Sucks Rocks (...)
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To: Welchie25; 2harddrive; Kansas58; goldstategop; Tolerance Sucks Rocks; NYer; Salvation; Biggirl; ...
I certainly wish that the Maryland Catholic Conference would keep in mind the teachings of the Church when attempting to speak for us Catholics:

JPII tells us the absolute truth about feel-good legilslation like minimum wage hikes:

It should be noted that in today's world, among other rights, the right of economic initiative is often suppressed. Yet it is a right which is important not only for the individual but also for the common good. Experience shows us that the denial of this right, or its limitation in the name of an alleged "equality" of everyone in society, diminishes, or in practice absolutely destroys the spirit of initiative, that is to say the creative subjectivity of the citizen. As a consequence, there arises, not so much a true equality as a "leveling down." In the place of creative initiative there appears passivity, dependence and submission to the bureaucratic apparatus which, as the only "ordering" and "decision-making" body - if not also the "owner"- of the entire totality of goods and the means of production, puts everyone in a position of almost absolute dependence, which is similar to the traditional dependence of the worker-proletarian in capitalism. This provokes a sense of frustration or desperation and predisposes people to opt out of national life, impelling many to emigrate and also favoring a form of "psychological" emigration.

Encyclical Sollicitudo Rei Socialis, 15

Now we can go back a few decades to see the wisdom of Pius XI on the subject:

…But another point, scarcely less important, and especially vital in our times, must not be overlooked: namely, that the opportunity to work be provided to those who are able and willing to work. This opportunity depends largely on the wage and salary rate, which can help as long as it is kept within proper limits, but which on the other hand can be an obstacle if it exceeds these limits. For everyone knows that an excessive lowering of wages, or their increase beyond due measure, causes unemployment…

Encyclical Quadragesimo Anno, 72

Now as to whether the so-called "Maryland Catholic Conference" should talk about this, let us also refer to the teachings of the Church:

As JPII stated (specifically about economic models):

43. The Church has no models to present; models that are real and truly effective can only arise within the framework of different historical situations, through the efforts of all those who responsibly confront concrete problems in all their social, economic, political and cultural aspects, as these interact with one another.

Encyclical Centessimus Annus, 43

Or as Paul VI stated (more generally):

The Church, which has long experience in human affairs and has no desire to be involved in the political activities of any nation, "seeks but one goal: to carry forward the work of Christ under the lead of the befriending Spirit. And Christ entered this world to give witness to the truth; to save, not to judge; to serve, not to be served.''

Encyclical Populorum Progressio, 13

Or as our Beloved Benedict XVI summarized very clearly:

The Church does not have technical solutions to offer and does not claim “to interfere in any way in the politics of States.” She does, however, have a mission of truth to accomplish, in every time and circumstance, for a society that is attuned to man, to his dignity, to his vocation.

Encyclical Caritas in Veritate, 9

Even Vatican II had it right.

Vatican II teaches us that the governance of the world is the particular competence of the laity, not the clergy.

Secular duties and activities belong properly although not exclusively to laymen. Therefore acting as citizens in the world, whether individually or socially, they will keep the laws proper to each discipline, and labor to equip themselves with a genuine expertise in their various fields. They will gladly work with men seeking the same goals. Acknowledging the demands of faith and endowed with its force, they will unhesitatingly devise new enterprises, where they are appropriate, and put them into action. Laymen should also know that it is generally the function of their well-formed Christian conscience to see that the divine law is inscribed in the life of the earthly city; from priests they may look for spiritual light and nourishment. Let the layman not imagine that his pastors are always such experts, that to every problem which arises, however complicated, they can readily give him a concrete solution, or even that such is their mission. Rather, enlightened by Christian wisdom and giving close attention to the teaching authority of the Church,(17) let the layman take on his own distinctive role.

Often enough the Christian view of things will itself suggest some specific solution in certain circumstances. Yet it happens rather frequently, and legitimately so, that with equal sincerity some of the faithful will disagree with others on a given matter. Even against the intentions of their proponents, however, solutions proposed on one side or another may be easily confused by many people with the Gospel message. Hence it is necessary for people to remember that no one is allowed in the aforementioned situations to appropriate the Church's authority for his opinion. They should always try to enlighten one another through honest discussion, preserving mutual charity and caring above all for the common good.

Pastoral Constitution, Gaudium et Spes, 43

In light of the above, I, for one, would prefer it if the episcopal hierarchy and their staffs would really concentrate primarily upon those moral principles and assist with the formation of the lay peoples' consciences. And then, as is taught in GS (above), the laity should use those consciences, in conjunction with their technical skills, to formulate solutions. Provided those solutions do not clearly and unambiguously violate moral teaching, I would think it appropriate that the hierarchy remain silent.

24 posted on 01/22/2014 1:37:00 AM PST by markomalley (Nothing emboldens the wicked so greatly as the lack of courage on the part of the good -- Leo XIII)
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