Posted on 09/06/2013 6:51:23 AM PDT by maggief
I do hope someone pursues that line of reasoning.
Again?
Russians have a need to try their new missiles in combat situation and this maybe excellent opportunity to do so without any escalation between US and Russia. Simply provided military help to their allies.
I don’t think the Russian warships will engage US warships at first anyway. If they are not shooting they won’t be shot at. That job is for the P-800 Oniks the Russians sold Syria, fired from Syrian shore, then Russians are only observers as the US ships fight for their lives, and Russia stays unencombered for at least the first engagements.
And Russian arms on the way could be more of these sort of antiship missiles, and advanced SAMs and even the Russian technicians to target and fire them, so as to be used on short notice without having to take time to train the Syrians in their use. As far as the US is concerned there is no way to know the nationality of those using the shore based weapons, unlike a weapon originating from a Russian warship.
I think the Russian warships are there for symbolic reasons at this point, but also to mop up and engage later in the crisis as it develops. And as it escalates, introduces a tactical nuclear capability at sea that the US lacks as a trump card. (The US removed all tactical nukes from non strategic naval platforms in 1991, Russia was suppose to as well, but has been reported as retaining that capability and weapons in reserve, and could plausibly be deployed with the Russian ships)
I’ve gotten a lot of grief for saying this, but I don’t care. If we could somehow have an election in the U.S. between Putti and Obama, I’d vote for Putin in a heartbeat.
He’s instituted a flat tax. He’s shown that he knows how to deal with terrorist Muzzies within Russia. And he doesn’t kowtow to the Faggot Lobby.
That’d be three big improvements over the current WH occupant.
ank
Indeed:
1. Damascus obviously in greater danger of being destroyed.
2. Egypt divided against itself.
3. Christians in Egypt persecuted.
4. Christians in Syria persecuted/beheaded.
5. White horse prophecy fulfilled by election of O.
6. Red horse prophecy on the verge of fulfillment.
7. "The Obamanation" - let the reader understand.
8. The lawless one, adored by millions (initially).
9. Nations gathering/surrounding Israel.
10.Homosexual marriage now/iniquity abounds.
11.Last pope in office now.
12.2018 will be 70 years (generation) since state of Israel.
13.Earthquakes and volcanoes steadily increasing.
14.Christians being persecuted worldwide.
15.Knowledge vastly increasing (facebook/twitter).
16.Unusual comets, eclipses.
17.Two blood moons in both '14 and '15 on exact same Jewish High Sabbath days (watch for signs).
18.Economic turmoil, new currency likely.
19.The word spread throughout the world.
20.And more.
Inforwars reported that a Chinese Type 071 Landing Platform Dock passed through the Suez canal. But it is Infowars and Alex Jones.
Not a credible source, and the usual list of suspects are feeding off the same single, unverified and unconfirmed report for all of their stories.
Until I get word from a far more credible source, I will simply not believe it.
That vessel is a part of the 14th or 15th Chinese task force to the Arabian Sea to do the international anti-piracy thing.
The Chinese have little to no interest in Syria, and the vessel in question would not go in there alone in any case. It would have to have a frigate or destroyer as an escort, particularly in a potentially hot combat zone.
Just too risky for the Chinese to do woith one of their three such vessels, which they view as a capitol ship. Little or no gain for them and their interests.
Definitely a dangerous game and lots of potential for errors in this entire scenario.
The US should not be contemplating attacking in the first place. There is absoilutely NO compelling intrest for us, and no compelling evidence that Assad did the chemcial attack in the first place...which in and of itself is no reason for us to attack.
There is at least as much physical and circumstantial evidence that it was the rebels themselves who did it.
One credible foreign journalist, known in the region who reports for the BBC and for AP in the region, and fluent in the dialects there in Syria, went into Damascus at the site of the incident and found rebel foot soldier who said that it was a botched attack attempt by them where their chemcial weapons detonated prematurely.
Either way, whichever side did it, it is still not a reason for us to involve the US military. War kills people. These two “bad guys” are killing each other and we ar now indicvating that we are going to go in and attack Syrians fpor attacking other Syrrians. It is ludicrous.
In fact, our best interest in the region, given who is fighting whom there and what the poutcome would be if either side won, would be to have Assad win because he would be more stable to our interests (even if unfriendly) than any fundamental Sunni government resulting from a branch of Al-Uuida prevailing.
As to the Iranina airliner. That was a long time ago when AEGIS was relatively new...and that aircraft did not respond to warnings, was not properly broadcasting IFF, and was on what could easily have been an attack profile against the US vessels, them not knowing it was a commercial airliner.
It was tragic, but in the duty of the CO and entire command chain to protect US lives in a zone where military activities were occurring to protect commericial shipping from the war there at the time, the vessel, IMHO, acted the only way they could given the circumstances. I place the blame for that at the feet of the Iranian crew on the aircraft.
If our forces do get an order to strike, I believe that as long as no mistakes are made, and as long as we do not attempt to bring about a strong destabilization of the forces Assad has arrayed against the rebels, that the baloons between ourselves and Russia will not go up.
Obama will walk around like a peacock indacting he “swoed Assad,” and he will be an abject lauching stock. Putin will moan and complain, and will use it all against the Obama and the US and to his interest benefit...and things will go on as they were.
I believe Putin can keep Assad under control if all of that happens.
The real loose cannon is Iran. If they go off and attack our base in Bahrain, or launch a major attack against Israel, everything could change quickly and get out of hand.
Found this report by DEBKA:
A Chinese landing craft with 1,000 marines for Syria – reports
DEBKAfile September 6, 2013, 12:31 PM (GMT+02:00) Western naval sources reported Friday that a Chinese landing craft, the Jinggangshan, with a 1,000-strong marine battalion had reached the Red Sea en route for the Mediterranean off Syria. According to DEBKAfile, Beijing has already deployed a number of warships opposite Syria in secret. If the latest report is confirmed, this will be the largest Chinese deployment in the Middle East in its naval history.
These reports cite reports from Egypt and the Chinese PLA. Will keep and eye open for any reports from western sources and ping you if I see any.
Thanks,
The Israelis knowcked out most, if not all of those missiles a couple of months ago in an attack on the port aimed specifically at those missiles.
Also, those missiles, while very dangerous, have significantly less range than our Tomahawks, so our ships can stay far enough out to sea to be able to hit all the targets in Syria without coming into range of those missiles even if Syria has some left.
Those missiles would be a lot more dangerous to us if they were able to be loaded on the SU-24s or Mig-29s Assad has...but that capability never arrived in Syria and the aircraft have not been upgraded to launch them. The Yahkonts have a range that is comparable to our Standard Missile defenses on the AEGHIS destroyers, so aircraft carrying them may be able to launch them without haveing to enter the kill envelope of the SMs.
But, they did not get that capability, and as I said, the Israelis got most, if not all of those missiles anyway. Any they have left would be launched from shore and we will simply stay out of their range.
Now, the Syrians have 75-100 Kh-31 missiles, which they can load onto the SU-24s and Mg-29s. They too are danerous weapons. But their range is signifcantly shorter than the Standard Missiles the AEGIS destroyers are firing and so the aircraft have to fly quite a distance into the Standard Missile envelope and are going to get hammered before they ever launch. We have all the advantage in such an engagement because our AWACS will see any large group of aircraft taking off, forming up, and coming out against the US vessels. We will be ready for them.
If we do not have our own aircraft up out of Italy to intercept them, or the French carrier aircraft do not intercept them (which I believe they would) then they still have to fly fairly deep into the combined weight of five AEGIS destroyers missile defense before they can launch.
I do not believe Assad will throw away his entire modern air force to take the chance (and a bad one at that) that he might get a hit from any of those Kh-31s.
Nothing credible to this point, and that ship would never enter the Med alone, even in good circumstances.
No reason for them to do this in terms of compelling interests. If we get pictures of it passing through the canal from a credible outlet, I will take it seriously.
But even if it did, that vessel will not provide any material military advantage to Syria or the Russians.
Fair enough.
‘Special cargo’ is probably a bacon and vodka for Christians and Alawites. Just to play USN for fools if they are to intercept it for inspection (Remember Bolivian Air Force #1 forced down over Snowden’s rumor).
I think its going to be a shooting war with the US trying to launch a limited strike with too little too late.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZHVMUZ7hHRo
AFAIK, missiles are P-800, not Kh-31 and it’s range are on par or slightly wider comparing to most variants of Standards.
“I see an accidental missile war at sea, with burning and sinking warships on both sides.”
People arrogantly believe a carrier is untouchable. They would be shocked to hear one or two have been sunk in that exchange. Frankly, I think we keep too eggs in any one of those baskets. Send ten targets to the bottom and a nation could effectively destroy US air dominance in most parts of the world.
But but Obama STARED at him! USA 1 USSR 0 /sar
Carter just moved from WPOTUS to the good old days! lets put on sweaters for Jimmuh
She might be given red carpet. Ruskies are honeytrap pros.
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