Posted on 06/29/2013 7:52:35 AM PDT by Olog-hai
It took 50 years for American attitudes about marijuana to zigzag from the paranoia of “Reefer Madness” to the excesses of Woodstock back to the hard line of “Just Say No.”
The next 25 years took the nation from Bill Clinton, who famously “didn’t inhale,” to Barack Obama, who most emphatically did.
And now, in just a few short years, public opinion has moved so dramatically toward general acceptance that even those who champion legalization are surprised at how quickly attitudes are changing and states are moving to approve the drug—for medical use and just for fun. …
Washington policymakers seem reluctant to deal with any of it. …
(Excerpt) Read more at hosted.ap.org ...
The problem is that the government’s solution is much worse than the marijuana.
That’s what the outsourcing is for....
That whole “freedom” thing sure is frightening, isn’t it?
Why, bad things might happen!
No, no, we need a strong government - one that can protect us from all hazards - even ourselves!
Yes, if it saves just one child, we must crush this entire fad of freedom!
Vee must fight, until ze free welt unter control ist!
Wir werden kaempfen, bis die ROTA PFANNA die WELTFLAGGE ist!
Then we will be safe.
As far as the new recreational weed law goes there still isn't a legal supply and smoking weed in public isn't legal. When the law took effect a bunch of dopers went down to the Space Needle to light up and the police stood by and did nothing.
The supporters of the proposition wrote a law they thought would pass, but with no expectation of anything other than being allowed to walk with personal use weed. While, obviously, Seattle officials won't support enforcement of the provisions of that law, they will act when they figure out they are losing revenue.
Look at a different product, booze. The state has a long tradition of confiscatory tax rates on alcohol, despite shifting that business to retail stores last year. The rates under the new retail sales are high enough that sales have been flat while availability has increased. Now if I fired up a still, without a license and started selling my product the liquor control board would be all over me in a heartbeat. Somehow weed smokers are a different class.
>>Drinking (coffee, tea, alcoholic)?
You left out Big Gulps. Just wanted to get that in there for completeness.
There was a place like that in Ft. Lauderdale 25+ years ago, “R Doughnuts”. Never went in, just drove by it when in town for site visits as it was near the construction project we had done the engineering on. I always wondered if the cops were allowed to visit, the doughnuts of course being a natural cop magnet.
The one consideration for legalizing weed to deal with the cartels is that they still make a majority of their money off the weed. If you legalized weed they would still smuggle coke, heroin, meth (remember when that was made in America?), and people. My guess is that they would make up the difference by fighting over territory and taking over all human smuggling. Depending on how bad the new immigration bill is, that might be a huge business opportunity for them. Controlling routes, coyotes and even the issue of ag worker visas on the Mexican side.
Don’t forget Wage & Price Controls.
http://www.cato.org/publications/commentary/remembering-nixons-wage-price-controls
It's giving our poor drug warriors the vapors.
Libertarianism has spread in America and shown great victories in advancing it’s agenda over the last 50 years.
This list is very close to being totally checked off as a success, another 5 to 15 years should make it complete.
Libertarian Party Platform:
Throw open the borders completely; only a rare individual (terrorist, disease carrier etc.) can be kept from freedom of movement through “political boundaries”, eliminate the Border Patrol and INS.
Homosexuals; total freedom in the military, gay marriage, adoption, child custody and everything else.
Abortion; zero restrictions or impediments full 9 months.
Pornography; no restraint, no restrictions.
Drugs; Meth, Heroin, Crack, and anything new that science and marketers can come up with, zero restrictions.
Advertising those drugs, prostitution, and pornography; zero restrictions.
Military Strength; minimal capabilities.
You are certainly for abortion then right? Since it’s their choice to insert whatever into their bodies, no matter the harm done..
I knew that would come up sooner or later. No, I am as diametrically opposed to abortion as I am against the War on XYZ. It’s one of the few areas I believe needs to be corrected in the (L) platform.
Man and Women have as much Right to do as they wish to/with each other (sex) until the consequences of those actions (pregnancy).
Once that egg and sperm merge, that new entity is unique in this World. It’s DNA is not mother, not father. No longer it is it the female’s body to do as she wish; she then becomes the host of that entity/zygote/baby/child. (My favorite analogy is that of host and parasite...horrible to think, but it does fall within the definition).
Now, if that same unique being is non-viable on its own, that is one thing, but, if anything, I think the (L) misses in this point: Carrying to term and birthing a new human being IS the consequences of sex (not the only possible, but that is what the process is designed to do).
Else, as we have today: an unfair and unjust system.
- No consequences for the female for their actions (most at the economic deprivation of other Citizens = welfare/etc.)
- Economic slavery of the male if the female wishes to carry to term, regardless of his wishes
- Destruction of the child, regardless of the males wishes
Hopefully, that lays it out well enough. Freedom with consequences. Simple as that. Now, back to the topic of discussion.
It’s not even just the drug warriors. There are WAY too many who feel they know better how others should live. It is why I am a (L).
I’ve looked into the Constitution Party, but when your party platform looks like some of the more recent Congressional bills, that’s too many words needed when our Constitutions takes only 4,440.
For those few things I am at odds w/ the (L) platform, I believe they can be readily fixed. I have more belief in their words, after election, than I ever have, or will, for the current back-stabbing 2 party cartel. Unfortunately, the ‘battered spouse’ syndrome seems to be political as well; and most/some people just refuse to open their eyes.
I believe you’re only saying that about abortion because of the site rules. IOW, I think you’re lying. Also, is smoking or drinking at all while pregnant then child abuse?
I’m here to lay out my thoughts/ideas in a well-reasoned and articulate manner to (hopefully) further the topic of debate. I cannot make anyone read, understand nor change their minds that don’t wish to think. But, I am far from giving a rats ass to what anyone ELSE believes. Welcome to the internet.
And, I care about the forum rules as much as I care about 99% of the Unconstitutional ‘laws’ on the books....you either support Freedom or you don’t. If that means my getting kicked, so be it. I’ve posted enough I think would give me a ‘time-out’, if not banned, if someone got their panties in a wad. I don’t own the board, they are free to do as they wish for whatever reason.
As for your last question, I’ll have to defer to a “NO”:
1) Do we not already jail mothers (and I ‘ll use the term loosely in this instance) who birth drug-addicted, fetal alcohol syndrome, etc. children?
2) MOST things in moderation are not harmful. Drinking alone has been shown (again, this time?) to be a benefit, when limited to 1 glass/day. Science is NOT the end-all of knowledge.
3) What other criteria supersedes Freedom or Parental Rights? Over-weight (define THAT to begin)? Doesn’t exercise? Stops smoking, but picks it back up after birth (in home/car)? Past depression/Postpartum? Feeds dessert before dinner?
4) Already, one cannot discipline their own children w/out fear from Child Services (NAZI hold out as I’ve ever seen). THEY are ‘the State’ and what is brought to bear when the child is ‘at risk’. They should be called as often as SWAT is to give out speeding tickets.
I could prob. show for each ‘bad’ where a child grew up in the same w/out detriment. Hell, George Burns lived to be, what, 100+ and smoked cigars EVERY day? Tobacco industry still on the hook for his death?
No, until actual harm, gov’t PROTECTS Rights and takes a back seat otherwise.
Libertarians do play that game of pretending to be for banning any and all abortions.
They also play games about immigration.
Here is the full text (not the short summary) version of the libertarian position on immigration as an example of the libertarianism that FR lib promoters try to avoid.
COMPLETE PLATFORM TEXT
INDIVIDUAL RIGHTS AND CIVIL ORDER
IMMIGRATION:
“”THE ISSUE: We welcome all refugees to our country and condemn the efforts of U.S. officials to create a new “Berlin Wall” which would keep them captive. We condemn the U.S. government’s policy of barring those refugees from our country and preventing Americans from assisting their passage to help them escape tyranny or improve their economic prospects.
THE PRINCIPLE: We hold that human rights should not be denied or abridged on the basis of nationality. Undocumented non-citizens should not be denied the fundamental freedom to labor and to move about unmolested. Furthermore, immigration must not be restricted for reasons of race, religion, political creed, age or sexual preference. We oppose government welfare and resettlement payments to non-citizens just as we oppose government welfare payments to all other persons.
SOLUTIONS: We condemn massive roundups of Hispanic Americans and others by the federal government in its hunt for individuals not possessing required government documents. We strongly oppose all measures that punish employers who hire undocumented workers. Such measures repress free enterprise, harass workers, and systematically discourage employers from hiring Hispanics.
TRANSITIONAL ACTION: We call for the elimination of all restrictions on immigration, the abolition of the Immigration and Naturalization Service and the Border Patrol, and a declaration of full amnesty for all people who have entered the country illegally.””
It is referred to as “needle” park.
They represent the worst of both conservatism and liberalism. The ‘do what feels good’ part and an internationalism that goes with that too. Also, extreme selfishness. All the worst traits of humanity.
Post 50 is perfectly accurate as post 57 showed.
Here is the libertarian position on abortion, as post 50 says it is “Abortion; zero restrictions or impediments full 9 months.”
Here is their wording.
1.4 Abortion
Recognizing that abortion is a sensitive issue and that people can hold good-faith views on all sides, we believe that government should be kept out of the matter, leaving the question to each person for their conscientious consideration.
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