Brave mother and daughter stood alongside Cub Scout leader against Islamic fanatics

'A mother and daughter were the 'Angels of Woolwich' who bravely risked their own lives to comfort the soldier left dying in the street.

Gemini Donnelly-Martin, 20, and her mother Amanda, stepped forward and asked the attackers if they could be by Drummer Lee Rigby's side.

Their refusal to be cowed by the terrorists won praise from all quarters, including Downing Street.

Although other bystanders watched in horror and police waited helplessly for armed officers to arrive, Gemini modestly insisted her and her mother were not heroes and had done what anyone else would do.

She told the Daily Mirror: 'We did what anyone would do. We just wanted to take care of the man. It wasn't brave. Anyone would have done it. It had to be done. They (the killers) said women could pass.'

'The only thing people need to worry about is that poor man's mum. We are grateful, though, for what people are saying about us.'

When it became apparent Drummer Lee Rigby was beyond their help, they shielded his body from further desecration by his savage attackers.

Amanda, 44, insisted she be allowed to pray for the dead man even when confronted by one of the killer. Kneeling at his side, she cradled him gently, seemingly unfazed by his horrific wounds.

Yesterday Gemini was back searching for work at a local job fair while her mother did not want to talk about what happened.'

“....The US had a Muslim US Army Officer murder a dozen US troops and injure 3 dozen...all troops not armed per longstanding Army regulations. And we still refuse to call it an act of terror...”

Well, not “we”... but a certain muslim sympathetic enabler and his traitorous administration who happens to temporarily inhabit the White House, yes. Idiots that voted for him, yes.

But Rational, sane people know these animals for what they are, and take measures to ensure their own safety. By any means necessary, these days.

The difference is that here, if there were an armed citizen present, the act COULD be stopped before an innocent death ensued; in the UK, that does not appear to be the case.

From the videos I’ve seen and the photos, there were dozens of people milling around while these two sand crabs RAILED about how no one was safe from them, they’d kill everyone, etc.,. There should have been two dozen men beating the living sh*t out of them before the police got anywhere NEAR the scene - using anything available; soda bottles, rocks, briefcases, belt buckles, etc. Anything. But they were unmolested after basically beheading a British soldier.

These worthless pieces of garbage should have been battered bloody wreckage BEFORE the police ever got there.

Non-violence doesn’t work. being unarmed - or disarmed - doesn’t work. Our own Sandy Hook shows that. Fort Hood shows that. Columbine showed it. Any other number of killings in so-called “Gun Free Zones” show it. If there are armed men present, the predator will go where there are no armed men present.

It doesn’t surprise me - nor should it surprise anyone who has even a smidgeon of intelligence - that animals will attack people where they KNOW there is little chance of being shot dead either before or during their commission of the crime.

These two pieces of muslim garbage knew no one would intervene.

The same can’t be said here in the US, except in gun control Utopias like New Jersey, Massachusetts, Illinois, etc. And even in THOSE states, there ARE Patriots who carry in defiance of the law.

We will never give up our guns voluntarily here. Some will; most won’t. We know history, and we’ve seen this movie before.

Sorry for the loss of your soldier, Scotsman. Prayers to the family.

I’m sorry for the loss of your unified culture and National identity in letting these savages come to your country and then feel confident enough to get away with an act like this. We have the same problem here to a lesser degree, thanks to liberal socialists. But I think, however, that here, we can still do something about it when the time comes.

We love Britian, but we have a problem being honest, without insulting you, in part because your position is naturally shameful (in a technical, psychological sense). Any honest discussion of it will tend to come off as an attack because of this. Conservative Americans are very group-centric. As a result, our urges promote very little shame, since they will usually be pro-group (shame being an urge designed to correct individualistic behavior, replacing it with group-centric behavior within the group). Where your position evokes shame, it is because it isn’t group-centric, but individualistic. (for the record, I’m not attacking you here, but given our group-centric evolutionary history, being completely honest will come off that way in places.)

When you oppose arming your countrymen, and your police, you say two things. One, you think you are better than them, because you can own a gun, but they are not good enough to do what you do, as responsibly as you do. You also say you think things like what happened to your soldier are not important enough for everybody to get involved to stop it. It is not the individual citizen’s responsibility to stop it, because you are not responsible for each other.

American Conservatives see this differently - much more group-centrically. A soldier getting killed in our street is everyone’s problem – each of us, individually. Every one of us has a responsibility to get involved, and deal with it. Because of that, all of us should have the right to be armed. Standing around in shock, helpless, is not an option. Our motivation to support arming everyone is the motivation to stop that from happening.

Where our police need to deal with this, we want them armed too – not only so they can stop it, but because they are our brothers, and we want them as capable as we are. We want them able to defend themselves, because we care about them as we care about our own loved ones, whom we would alo want armed. To us, expecting them to face this unarmed would be disloyal to them, and unappreciative of their willingness to sacrifice for us. In America, we are all a team, and our willingnes to see everyone armed is an expression of love and loyalty for each other.

To us, the British culture you describe has a weird sense of hostility among citizens, where everyone suspiciously views everyone else as incapable and untrustworthy, and needing control, lest they hurt someone else. Where a soldier murdered in the street by a Muslim Terrorist is preferable to trusting fellow citizens who choose to to arm up to take the coure, get licensed, and carry the means by which to stop it. The policy you support only makes sense if you view a sizable number of your fellow citizens as untrustworthy scumbags, and believe they would do worse if allowed to carry.

Again, I am not attacking you, but in honestly describing urges which are consistent with selfishness and distrust of compatriots, and contrary to the group-centric urges we are programmed to expect from in-group members, it will come off as an attack.

I am mainly being honest, because it is how I would want you to be with me. If after Sept 11th, I was supporting things which would have lost the War on Terror for America, and you called me on it because you wanted America to win, I would have respected and appreciated that.

Here, we want the decent folk of Britain to win (The Leftist traitors can and should burn). These things will get worse. We know the Euro is coming down. A banking crisis is likely to follow. As the economy goes down, it will affect food availability and distribution. Muslims aren’t playing well with others now, when everything is rosey. How many do you think will turn to Jihad once that collapse happens, and those losers are hungry and bitter, and they see you guys eating and comfortable? You may look like 90’s Bosnia, maybe even 80’s Lebannon.

You good folk of Britain will have to trust and rely on each other, if you are to make it through that storm with your freedom. You will need to view cops as compatriots, citizens as compatriots, and military as compatriots, all of you the responsibility for each other. You will all need the tools to protect each other, and you will all have to trust each other. If you don’t make that adjustment at some point, it will be brutal, because each of you will end up as alone as that soldier. Freedom and British greatness will die with you, and all that will be left is savagery and oppression.

Again, I wouldn’t waste time posting to you if I didn’t care about your nation, and its good people.

Good luck.

Thank you for your kind post.

To clarify, I am pro-gun and support the repeal of all the gun laws in the UK. As to armed police, I do not support a FULLY-armed police force in the UK as imo it is not necessary. It it were or does become necessary, I’ll be the first to call for it.

quote: ‘You also say you think things like what happened to your soldier are not important enough for everybody to get involved to stop it. It is not the individual citizen’s responsibility to stop it, because you are not responsible for each other.’

Sorry, I never said that. In fact, I have argued in the last 24 hrs that people SHOULD have stopped them, that I would have myself, and I attacked the wimpish men who did nothing. Nor did say anything negative about responsibility. In fact, I am sick of the all-rights and no-responsibility culture in the UK and the west.

quote: ‘To us, the British culture you describe has a weird sense of hostility among citizens, where everyone suspiciously views everyone else as incapable and untrustworthy, and needing control, lest they hurt someone else. Where a soldier murdered in the street by a Muslim Terrorist is preferable to trusting fellow citizens who choose to to arm up to take the coure, get licensed, and carry the means by which to stop it. The policy you support only makes sense if you view a sizable number of your fellow citizens as untrustworthy scumbags, and believe they would do worse if allowed to carry.’

I am again strongly pro-gun and am for more UK people being allowed to own them. I have, and most British people do, a concern though that we dont end up, with all due respect, like America. A nation sated in guns, with a shockingly high level of gun violence. Even as a pro-gun man, I want to avoid that.

BUT to be honest, the British have never been gun owners anyway. Even when all guns were legal and before the idiotic kneejerk laws. I might be wrong, but the most pre-1997 (last major gun law) was I think 2.6m guns in a pop. of 60m.

So the British people simply dont have any interest in owning guns even if they could own as many as they wanted as easily as they wanted. I know that seems odd to Americans, perhaps its because we werent built on the gun as America was. Guns are simply not a large part of our culture.

Thanks for the post. And I equally wouldnt reply or even be here if I didnt have a deep affection for America and Americans.

All we want, very badly, is decent Brits living in freedom, and these animals dead and gone.

“Sorry, I never said that. In fact, I have argued in the last 24 hrs that people SHOULD have stopped them, that I would have myself, and I attacked the wimpish men who did nothing. Nor did say anything negative about responsibility. In fact, I am sick of the all-rights and no-responsibility culture in the UK and the west.”

Stopping that would have been near impossible, however, if unarmed. One attacker with a knife is going to be a rough ride to take on, even with a knife yourself - and you are definitely getting cut. Two at the same time, is a near impossibility unless you can drive over them with a car first, which probably would have been the best bet. If you want men in the crowd intervening, you have to allow the ones who want to, to carry concealed. Otherwise, you are expecting them to take on a suicide mission.

I respect that as a former military man, you would have the loyalty and the stones to make a run at it all the same, but I would much rather have seen you just pull out your Glock, and drop both guys safely from 8 yards. In general, anybody without a criminal record who wants to carry a gun, is on our team. I cannot fathom any reason for not supporting them carrying, especially as we approach bad times when stuff like this may happen regularly. You don’t have to carry everywhere, but when times call for it, I would want it as simple for you as strapping on a holster.

“I am again strongly pro-gun and am for more UK people being allowed to own them. I have, and most British people do, a concern though that we don’t end up, with all due respect, like America. A nation sated in guns, with a shockingly high level of gun violence. Even as a pro-gun man, I want to avoid that.”

Don’t buy the anti-gun bull from the left, in any amount. The truth is, the gun violence doesn’t happen where the guns are legal. Our problem is that the rules aren’t consistent. One area will have free gun laws, while nearby nobody is allowed to carry, or be armed. So criminals in the restricted area have free reign, since they carry their easily acquired, illegal guns, while everyone else is disarmed. It not only promotes gun violence, but crime as well, since cowardly criminals can break a small weapons law, and suddenly have the power of life or death over everyone who obeys the law in that restrictive area. The funniest thing about guns is how legalizing them diminishes crime and improves civility. It is incredibly counter-intuitive. John Lott’s book was a fantastic, and eye-opening analysis of that.

Where the guns are legalized, crime plummets, just off the threat. Louisiana had over 700 carjackings back a while ago. They passed a law saying carjackers could be shot on sight. In the next six months, they had 2 carjackings, with no shootings - just the threat was enough. Yet where guns are outlawed, crime jacks up. There is no better way to bring about civility, than to threaten that the good folk will become uncivil. Plus, if somebody like these Muslims tries something, they get killed by a populace of decent people that works together as a force for good.

“So the British people simply don’t have any interest in owning guns even if they could own as many as they wanted as easily as they wanted. I know that seems odd to Americans, perhaps its because we weren’t built on the gun as America was. Guns are simply not a large part of our culture.”

A few more of these incidents, and I think that will change. You know, there is a place online which ships guns anywhere, though at a huge markup (used Beretta 92FS was about $2,000, IIRC, whereas it would normally be ~$450). They break them up, and hide them in a bunch of different innocent parcels, to get them to you undetected, and then you reassemble them. I’d file the address away, given what’s coming.

http://gizmodo.com/5927379/the-secret-online-weapons-store-thatll-sell-anyone-anything

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