Posted on 01/07/2013 8:36:44 AM PST by IbJensen
They have to truly fight to save the nation, not continue 'reaching across the aisle' to grope at the left. Any groping of these sycophantic morons is beyond disgusting. Rather it's belly-wrenching puking to even consider bi-partisanship! It should be removed from their vocabulary and the realization sink in that they're dealing with satan's disciples and their constituent's bitter enemies.
Take votes away from the GOP.
/johnny
Americans want big government and don’t want to cut spending. If you don’t believe me, pick out the most conservative area you can think of and see what happens when you propose cutting some program that would affect them. They, and their representatives, will howl as loudly as any liberal would about losing their pork.
Another lie, all the tax rates were going up if this wasnt passed (or plan B) as the two year extension ended.
In the case of this latest deal it wasnt just O who painted Bohner in a corner.
The we dont want nuthin passed into law R caucus in the House joined Dems in rejecting plan B, and that plan would would have keep even more of the taxes from going up than the final bill without the added spending.
It didnt take a rocket scientist to figure out that Bohner would not block partial tax cut extensions from being passed into law to keep most voters from getting a income tax increase.
I was posting here in November he would not take the blame for all those taxes going up, and I noticed no one challenged him to be Speaker themselves. Once they killed plan B Bohner said he will put a Senate passed extension up for a vote and he did.
The FC deal was excellent achievement. Without it, ALL TAX BRACKETS would have lost Bush tax cuts.
When democraps own the WH & Senate, and GOP has a mere 12 member advantage in House, to think that GOP could over power the democraps and get everything they wanted is totally unrealistic.
Now Bush tax rates are permanent which is much better than the deal Bush got which had an expiration date. With an expiration date, the democraps can simply let them expire, and no one in MSM will call it a tax hike.
With a permanent rate, the congress will have to actually produce a TAX HIKE bill. It can’t be hidden from the voters. That is a big difference.
As for the payroll tax, it was a TEMPORARY holiday. It had an expiration date. And it expired.
Even better in the FC deal is the PERMANENT rates of 15% on Dividends and Capital Gains. That is a superior gift to any one who has lead a disciplined spending pattern and accumulated a viable 401-k, and also the seniors who own lion’s share of the stock market.
So my kudos to McConnell for getting the Chicago community organizer to accept increase death tax threshold to $5-10 Million from the $1 Million threshold sans the FC bill.
I been making similar points, the opposition to the better plan B was all based on a lie : That taxes would not of went up if the House blocked anything from passing.
So the argument was dishonest from the start.
So now they are complaining that this passed Senate bill didnt have enough budget cuts, so Bohner was supposed to block tax cut extensions and ensure all the Bush rates went up because it was missing spending cuts?
Is this the argument?
Many have been bred-conditioned (brain-washed propagandized) into believing “Bush Rates” are a good thing.
With this facade (another government bailout), price on essentials, food, gas, autos, housing, etc., stay high, and thus MORE out of the paycheck comes out.
The market would have down 400> points, and prices would have started down. Now instead of of the paycheck going farther, it continues to go less to where it should due to fed paychecks driving up the prices on everything.
You don’t “save a ton of money”, by the paycheck not going as far. The standard of living continues to fall. along with the “brainwashing” that zero down brings ownership (in reality bank rent) of vehicle. Brainwashing.
There is no such thing a PERMANENT as far as taxes are concerned. Future Congresses are not bound by such agreements. These tax rates have no sunset clause, which doesn't make them PERMANENT.
The dividend and capital gains rates were raised on the so-called rich. Specifically,
Capital gains tax and dividends tax will be 20 percent for taxpayers with income over $400,000 (single) and $450,000 (joint filers). This does not include the new 3.8 percent health care tax on investment income above $200,000 (single) and $250,000 (joint filers) in adjusted gross income, so the top rate for capital gains and dividends will be 23.8 percent. For lower income levels, the tax will be 0 percent, 15 percent, or 18.8 percent.
This "excellent achievement" included:
Raises estate and gift tax to 40 percent, but above the current exemption level (~$5.12 million) and adjusted for inflation in future years.
Extends emergency unemployment compensation (EUC) and extended benefits (EB) unemployment insurance program through January 1, 2014.
Postpones sequester by two months; will now occur on March 27, 2013 (same day as the continuing resolution expires)
Phases out personal exemptions (PEP) for adjusted gross income over $250,000 (single), $275,000 (head of household) and $300,000 (joint filers).
Limits itemized deductions (Pease) for adjusted gross income over $250,000 (single), $275,000 (head of household) and $300,000 (joint filers)
The Reps created this crisis by agreeing to just extending the Bush tax cuts for two years after the 2010 midterms and signing on to the WH sequestration trap in 2011. The Reps are getting outsmarted in every deal. We need to examine the 157 page Fiscal Cliff deal closely. I bet there are other surprises including the pork that was also included in the deal.
I have seen your posts and yes, you have made rational comments. Most criticizers of the FC bill make blanket statements with NOTHING CONCRETE item by item refutation of the bill. So it is just hot air, and nothing substantive or realistic.
Neither Obama or the Republicans are the main problem with the nation imo. The problem with the country is hypocritical "patriots" who complain that Obama isn't respecting the Constituton, patriots themselves evidently not taking the initiative to learn the Constitution and its history.
In fact, if voters were to get up to speed on about two pages worth of constitutional statutes and case precedents, then they could arguably close down the unconstitutionally big federal government overnight. Patriots need to get up to speed on the Constitution's Section 8 of Article I, Article V, the 10th Amendment and also Justice John Marshall's clarification that Congress is prohibited from laying taxes in the name of state power issues, issues which Congress has no Section 8 authority to address.
"Congress is not empowered to tax for those purposes which are within the exclusive province of the States." --Justice John Marshall, Gibbons v. Ogden, 1824.And let Judge Andrew Napolitanto read Section 8 of Article I to you.
Judge Napolitano & the ConstitutionIn their wildest imagination, the drafters of the Constitution evidently didn't foresee that the best idea of the pursuit of happiness for many citizens would be to complain about tyrannical government, today's problems with unconstitutionally big federal government evidence that the part of the Constitution following the happiness clause was not worth the effort to write.
Yes, only death and taxes are permanent.
However even a superficial intellect can see the difference between a taxcut which HAS AN EXPIRATION DATE and on which DOES NOT.
With an expiration date, congress has to do NOTHING and it expires. With a permanent taxcut, the congress HAS TO ACTUALLY WRITE A TAX INCREASE BILL and get it passed in both houses and signed by the president.
If one can’t see the difference, there is nothing any one can do to educate them.
However I will accede to you that the FC bill protects only MIDDLE CLASS tax payers (under $400-450k). The richer folks have gone back upto Clinton era tax rates. So I will take 98% of tax payers getting tax relief over none.
I can’t emphasize enough the benefits of extending the death tax threshold. Without the FC bill, every estate would be taxed at 55% over $1 Million. That was written into law signed by Bush-43.
With the $10 million threshold, innumerable small businesses will not close down when the owner expires.
I am no Bohner fan but I don't tolerate dishonesty.
Bohner was put in a completely impossible position on this, one where he nor any other Speaker would have had a chance to win due to how success/failure was defined(success=forcing Reid and O to extend all tax rates by the threat of having no tax cut extensions in law) , and to make it sound rational the lie was repeated that this bill raised taxes.
Keep in mind that O/Dems repeated this, as as Rush and his talk radio lackeys, are and the MSM does it too. Why would they all together set the goal posts for GOP victory completely out of reach, so they are certain to fail?
Rush just now called this bill a tax increase that Rs went along with while throwing away core beliefs(???) in the process, and then he admitted the Bush tax cuts were temporary, all within 3 minutes.
I think no one does not know the truth. Even Rush fans repeating this know.
That pretty well sums up our predicament. It will not get better until we recognize that stupidity alone can not account for the GOPe actions.
Only a superficial intellect could call any tax rate PERMANENT. I can understand why the Reps would want to point to this as some sort of accomplishment. In point of fact, Obama will get the credit for this since the Reps in the House voted two to one against approval of the bill.
With an expiration date, congress has to do NOTHING and it expires. With a permanent taxcut, the congress HAS TO ACTUALLY WRITE A TAX INCREASE BILL and get it passed in both houses and signed by the president. If one cant see the difference, there is nothing any one can do to educate them.
If the Dems are successful in winning the House back in 2014 then they will have all they need to readjust the tax rates any way they want in 2015. Obama and the Dems have this in mind as they have successfully divided the Reps and got many of them to agree to vote for an increase in the tax rates for the so-called rich, many of them small businesses. It is just another "Read my lips" moment for the Reps, aka The Stupid Party.,
However I will accede to you that the FC bill protects only MIDDLE CLASS tax payers (under $400-450k). The richer folks have gone back upto Clinton era tax rates. So I will take 98% of tax payers getting tax relief over none.
LOL. So all the BS Romney and the Reps put out about raising the taxes on the rich would hurt small businesses costing over 700,000 jobs is just mere blather? And the taxes did go up on the MIDDLE CLASS with the failure to renew the payroll tax holiday. 80% of American income earners pay more in payroll taxes than they do in income taxes. The Dems are already blaming the Reps for this.
The Dems are not finished with the tax issue. They will be pushing to "close tax loopholes" and other benefit that allow the rich and corporations to escape paying their "fair share." The Reps will still be portrayed as protecting the rich. It is all part of the narrative leading up to the 2014 midterms. Add to this the bad old Reps trying to cut the entitlement programs and you have the very real possibility of the Dems winning the House in 2014.
is spending now greater than it was?
Is revenue now greater than it was?
Well yes but it would have been much worse. </sarcasm>
Tax rates are all temporary unless it is a temporary tax then it is forever.
On January 1 all the tax rates went back to Clinton levels and this bill (passed Jan 2) pushed them back down to Bush levels for 99% So they went down not up
Those arguing that the bill raised taxes were lying, it was a tax cut.
RE: "Well yes but it would have been much worse. "
The 'dont pass nuthin into law' crowd got their way for 1 day and yes it was much worse, all taxes were are Clinton rates. That is where blocking this bill would of left them. This bill lowered them.
Rush just wanted all our taxes to go up because his did. So he called up down and down up as Gore would put it,.
Plan B didnt include that spending and it cuts taxes even more than this Senate bill did.
But no, the ‘dont pass nuthin into law’ crowd rejected that plan B (joining Pelosi yet) resulting in a much crappier deal’ So what did they win us?
I noticed none of them ran for Speaker either
There is no “off” switch to the beast on the Potomac.
As Paine pointed out, tyranny is not easily defeated.
“It will not get better until we recognize that stupidity alone can not account for the GOPe actions.”
Agreed. Stupidity gets some things right every once in a while if only by accident. To consistently do wrong is complicity.
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