Posted on 12/28/2012 5:11:18 AM PST by 1010RD
Edited on 12/28/2012 5:14:39 AM PST by Admin Moderator. [history]
More than 250 Illinois clergy
(Excerpt) Read more at chicagotribune.com ...
“I would argue that the heart of the question does not require an evaluation of homosexuality as a trait (a tendency or personality variation) but does demand an evaluation of marriage.
Namely, in a world with a huge number of friendship and relationship possibilities, how is marriage uniquely suited only for a male and a female?
Most forms of friendship between adults occur without any external ceremonies, licensing, or regulations. It is assumed that two adults (or three, or any number of adults) will regulate their quilting circle, their bowling team, their fitness-walking-buddyhood, their joint foodie explorations, their gabfests, their romances and amours, or whatever, according to their own preferenes and without public recognition or oversight.
If the adults’ relationship involves money, or property, or goods or services, that’s what private contracts are all about: again, the adults are assumed capable of contracting to their own mutual satisfaction.
In sum: adults don’t need oversight to regulate their relations with colleagues, friends, or lovers.
How is marriage between a woman and a man different from this? Because their sexual union (formalized in marriage) is the only kind of sexual union which can bring forth dependent offspring. And there needs to be an institution which keeps the man and the woman together with any children they bear.
In other words, marriage is not essentially about the intimate relations of adults. Theyu can manage that as they like. Marriage is essentially a bond between a potentially procreating couple, and the children who result from the bond.
If it were not for the possibility of begetting, the state would have no legitimate interest in the relationships of adults per se. There is no PUBLIC interest in regulating romances and love affairs. The PUBLIC interest is in securing the rights of dependent children by recognizing and defending their bond with their natural father and mother.”
Very well articulated and thought out. I remember one of the higher ups at a job I worked at a few years back. He was homosexual and complained about marriage being defined as between a man and a woman. I thought(though did not say for fear of losing my job) what is he worried for? No matter how hard he tries, he will never get pregnant. Why does he “need” for the government to actually become more involved and have power over his personal life than it does now?
Homosexuality isn’t normal,sane or safe behavior.It is deviant behavior that leads to long term mental or physical problems.Having something in common with someone else,like having the same junk,should not make for urges to bang one’s gender.It should result in seeking out the opposite gender.
Gay marriage is destined to end dismally,like any other social experiment based on a dubious foundation.
I highly doubt God would ever endorse any form of homosexuality,he wants sane and loving people.Homosexuals just don’t fit that bill.
The LCMS is much more conservative than the ELCA, so it's not surprising no LCMS churches ended up on the list of "gay friendly" churches. If any LCMS are "gay friendly", they're obviously confused and in the wrong denomination, and ought to join the ELCA.
>> I'm still interested if anyone finds the list of those clergy who signed the endorsement with their approval of the gay marriage legislation. <<
I'd like to see the actual list too, since the Tribune conveniently didn't print it. Those pastors and congregations were bold enough to make a public statement so they should have to deal with the consequences. Any Catholic parish (at least, a real Catholic Church in communion with the Pope, not a fake "Independent Catholic" one) would be in grave defiance of church teaching if they endorse gay marriage, and there should be immediate action taken by their bishop (I don't expect Cardinal George would grow a pair and do anything about it though, he lets that heretical Obama-loving "Father" Pfleger do whatever he wants). Any SBC Southern Baptist parish endorsing gay marriage would also be in direct defiance of their church's teachings, though there's probably several black SBC parishes in Chicago that are very pro-Obama, and unlike the Catholic Church, I don't think the SBC could enforce any of their doctrines. Mormons are very adamently against gay marriage too, though there's next to no Mormons in Illinois despite this state being the former HQ of the LDS.
>> the list of gay-friendly churches in Illinois <<
My guess is the bulk of the "gay marriage" signatories were Unitarian "churches" (some Unitarians don't even believe in God, why anyone would join one of their "churches" is beyond me... it would be like eating at a KFC that doesn't serve chicken). Also, virtually all the United Church of Christ parishes (Obama's "black power" church obviously eager to suck up to him) and probably quite a few liberal Episcopalian and Methodist parishes. Probably a lot of Reform Jewish rabbis signed it too, along with some "Conservative" Jewish rabbis (I doubt any Orthodox Jews did, though)
Nothing like helping destroy western civilization to be hip and trendy, ya know. Ironically I bet most of these "inclusive" churches are struggling to stay open. That's what happens when you take Christ out of Christianity.
THIS is Taking God’s Name in Vain!! Pretty sure God does NOT want GAY MARRIAGE!!!
I find it's usually because they have a RELATIVE that's gay.
I wonder how many black clergy are in that 250 number?
Jesus was not compassionate towards sin. Obviously these pastors and rabbis put sympasizing with sin above condemning sin. Jesus was big on telling sinners to repent and sin no more.
Deception is the modus operandi of the Progressive movement. They lied about capitalism and capitalists back at the turn of the last century and it is the tool of their master.
Note that the photos emphasize the “blackness” of the endorsement. This is an attempt to mold and sway blacks into the pro-homosexual camp.
God will hold the apostate accountable, but not the ill people of IL.
The flamers could care less about an institution they despise. They want marriage so that they can appear normal. Once we get used to the idea of them being just like us they will push to teach the crap in schools.
This is the homo agenda. Destroy marriage as we know it and then confuse children. Only twisted minds would discus fisting, toys and other deviant sexual practices to kindergarten age kids.
...I wouldn’t really count the snake handlers as an official church....
I for one am embarassed by the other residents of Illinois.
I have received several responses from conservative folks in Illinois. I am shocked. I thought the whole state was liberal. Sorry if I offended any good folks up there and actually relieved that there are a few there. Now please straighten out the rest of the sorry lot of them...lol
As is being leaned on by the Regime to line up and salute a moral atrocity with the imprint of Lord Moloch on it.
So who put this together? Rahm "Call Me" Emmanuel, or "Osagyefo King Down-Low the First" hisself?
Hit “post” just once, even if it seems not to be doing anything. It does that a lot.
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So which side are you on, dearie?
Such a troublous issue ... and you post on it so often, and yet manage to land dexterously on your toes.
So are you calling all the hets "deviants", clever fellow?
Sorry, FReeper, but there's a fat chance of that. This is the eruption-point (think MRSA) of a long-running seminary cabal some 45 years in preparation.
These people are hardened and confirmed perverts, determined to overthrow the moral order and have their way in every venue, including inside the sanctuaries of the biggest churches. All must acquiesce in homosexual sodomy, pederasty, exotic paraphilias, blackhearted perversion, and every degree and kind of amorality.
You are abosultely correct and your comments are truly insightful. We cannot leave children out of the marriage debate. Kids need two parents and those parents need to be married. That on average drives the best results for the woman, the man, the children and their society. That’s the historical fact and the science is catching up to it.
That said, my argument is on one narrative we’ve heard from the pro-homosexual lobby - that homosexuality is normal. That’s a logical fallacy called: equivocation. Normal has more than one meaning. Clearly, same-gender attraction isn’t ideal.
We have to push back against the reigning secularism and in my opinion do so using the very same tools the left uses. Here in this article they’re attacking us using a faith-based approach. These clergy are counterfeits in the same way the Chinese have a fake Dalai Lama.
Turnabout is fair play, especially when the facts and reality are on our side. Same-gender attraction is most likely a mental illness caused by epigenetic effects in the womb as well as a child’s environment.
Most people don’t know the history of how homosexuality was removed from the DSM. Here it is and as told by liberals:
http://www.thisamericanlife.org/radio-archives/episode/204/81-Words
Use it to sway the masses who are being groomed on the meme that homosexuality is “normal”.
We need many tacks to drive the argument back to God’s reality. Homosexuality is unhealthy physically. It is a mental illness which doesn’t make them evil, but points out a cure - spiritual, psychological or as a medical/chemical intervention.
That’s the only meme that will win against the Pink Mafia. Love (charity) the sinner and hate the sin - show that the sin is an abnormal result which is treatable and reversable (hope). Show it over and over again by sharing the best science we have including the above history by the liberals at NPR (faith).
We’ve then testified through faith, hope and charity (all of which endure eternally) using secular science and history. It’s a win-win.
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