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To: butterdezillion
Not sure what you mean by “registry”.

Onaka is the State Registrar. He's responsible for the registry of vital records for Hawaii. Vital records are the legal records of births, deaths marriages etc. You seem to be saying that although Onaka confirms that they have a BC for Obama, it isn't legally valid. My question is why would a State keep a registry of invalid vital documents?

229 posted on 09/05/2012 3:15:14 PM PDT by Natufian (t)
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To: Natufian

There is no question but that they keep non-valid records. Why have a void flag for their database if none of their records would ever need it? You think that as soon as somebody amends a record the HDOH tears that BC out of the book? Look in the laws or the retention schedules. The only time they are authorized to dispose of vital records is if there is an incomplete vital record that has not been pursued for a long time, and that doesn’t say that they SHALL destroy the records, only that they may come up with rules as to when they could dismiss that file.

If you look on the HDOh website and in the statues and rules it talks about converting a Certificate of Hawaiian Birth to a late birth certificate. A late birth certificate is not legally valid, yet they specifically describe how a person could convert their record at the HDOH to that non-valid record. So yes, they DEFINITELY have records there that are not valid.

Why? Because they are still evidence that might be needed somewhere down the line. In fact, HRS 338-17 talks about the probative value of late and altered BC’s and says that the probative value is determined when they are submitted as evidence to a judicial or administrative person or body. Hawaii assigns no probative value to that record, but that doesn’t mean that a judge couldn’t look at those records and say, “You know, there’s a good reason for this being late or altered, and given the other evidence that supports this, I think this record is credible.” In that event, the judge would determine that the BC is probative.

What the Hawaii law says, though, is that the State of Hawaii does not vouch for those claims being accurate. So nobody can legally say that Obama WAS born on Aug 4, 1961 in Honolulu, HI... etc at this point. If Obama wants somebody to be able to legally say that, he needs to submit the BC as evidence in a setting where evidentiary rules are in play and the whole picture needs to be looked at to decide whether that record has credibility or is a crock.

My suspicion is that there’s a good reason Obama has fought to keep that record from being analyzed for credibility, even though it is the ONLY WAY he can legally qualify to be President.

But in answer to what you’re saying, I am positive that they house non-valid records at the HDOH. Heck, they disclosed in their 1960-64 birth index the non-valid records for a couple of adopted boys. Those non-valid records are supposed to be sealed, even. But the HDOh had them right there on their list.


237 posted on 09/05/2012 3:39:55 PM PDT by butterdezillion
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