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To: muawiyah
Hmm, that script has been discarded as being quite counterproductive. Mitt has his critics, and so do the Mormons ~ but the motives can be and are frequently far different.

Please keep on the straight and narrow with this ~ people who don't like Mitt frequently don't care one way or the other about Mormonism. He's quite dislikable all on his own merits!

Not so!

If you have been paying attention at the back and forth going on here as to the handful who suffer from MDS (Mitt Derangement Syndrome) and their virulent Hatred for him, often times try and paint him (through his association and being a Mormon) with despicable/looney/strange behavior of the Mormon Church, crazy saying by John Smith or the most oft used "excuse" as to why Romney should not be considered and that being Mormons are "Not Christians."

Of course, these same individuals NEVER have anything to say when it comes to the many articles which links Dear Leader to Islamist/Muslim Brotherhood and how much more dangerous he/it is to our Security/Survival and give B. Hussein a complete pass thereon.

They always from their opposition bases solely on "Social Issues" and NEVER about National Security which IMHO trumps all else.

12 posted on 07/21/2012 8:52:11 AM PDT by Conservative Vermont Vet
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To: Conservative Vermont Vet
Look, as I said Mitt is quite dislikable but you're sounding quite paranoid about folks who don't like Mormonism.

These are two totally different topics.

Regarding Mitt's concern for national defense needs, he should have served. These pure civilian types who never served and aren't related to anybody who ever served ~ I don't think he even has a daughter in law who served ~ can go both ways so easily. Not that I distrust him on the issue, but I doubt he's as genuine as you think.

13 posted on 07/21/2012 9:05:14 AM PDT by muawiyah
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To: Conservative Vermont Vet

Regarding Obama, he’s a loser so why are you so engaged with what he’s up to. He’ll be out of there ~ if we have a candidate who is a trustworthy guy who knows how to be a winner once he’s in office.


14 posted on 07/21/2012 9:08:12 AM PDT by muawiyah
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To: Conservative Vermont Vet

Since you clam to be a real conservative, why again are you such an apparent rabid Romney supporter? He is not a conservative.
You disparage others from the “guilt by association”, then go on to list BHO associations as making him guilty. Why?
You claim that people who are apposed to Romney’s liberalism as hating him, there is no evidence of that hate. Why is exposing his record hate, you expose BHO’s record and call that patriotism.
mormonism is not Christianity, why are you insisting it is? When given point by point explanations of why it is not, you scream mormon hater rather than explain why you disagree. Why is that?
It appears that your obamahysteria has over come you, and your lack of knowledge and unwillingness to learn of mormonism has made you a rabid defender of something you know nothing about.
How sad for you.


16 posted on 07/21/2012 9:47:38 AM PDT by svcw (If one living cell on another planet is life, why isn't it life in the womb?)
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To: Conservative Vermont Vet
MDS (Mitt Derangement Syndrome)

Not to be confused with:

MAS (MORMONism Avoidance Syndrome)


The club motto is:

Look over THERE!!!

23 posted on 07/21/2012 2:16:46 PM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: Conservative Vermont Vet
Of course, these same individuals NEVER have anything to say when it comes to the many articles which links Dear Leader to Islamist/Muslim Brotherhood and how much more dangerous he/it is to our Security/Survival and give B. Hussein a complete pass thereon.



“I Will Be a Second Mohammed”

In the heat of the Missouri “Mormon War” of 1838, Joseph Smith made the following claim, “I will be to this generation a second Mohammed, whose motto in treating for peace was ‘the Alcoran [Koran] or the Sword.’ So shall it eventually be with us—‘Joseph Smith or the Sword!’ ”[1]

It is most interesting that a self-proclaimed Christian prophet would liken himself to Mohammed, the founder of Islam. His own comparison invites us to take a closer look as well. And when we do, we find some striking—and troubling—parallels. Consider the following.

  • Mohammed and Joseph Smith both had humble beginnings. Neither had formal religious connections or upbringing, and both were relatively uneducated. Both founded new religions by creating their own scriptures. In fact, followers of both prophets claim these scriptures are miracles since their authors were the most simple and uneducated of men.[2]

  • Both prophets claim of having angel visitations, and of receiving divine revelation to restore pure religion to the earth again. Mohammed was told that both Jews and Christians had long since corrupted their scriptures and religion. In like manner, Joseph Smith was told that all of Christianity had become corrupt, and that consequently the Bible itself was no longer reliable. In both cases, this corruption required a complete restoration of both scripture and religion. Nothing which preceded either prophet could be relied upon any longer. Both prophets claim they were used of God to restore eternal truths which once existed on earth, but had been lost due to human corruption.

  • Both prophets created new scripture which borrowed heavily from the Bible, but with a substantially new “spin.” In his Koran, Mohammed appropriates a number of Biblical themes and characters—but he changes the complete sense of many passages, claiming to “correct” the Bible. In so doing he changes many doctrines, introducing his own in their place. In like manner, Joseph Smith created the Book of Mormon, much of which is plagiarized directly from the King James Bible. Interestingly, the Book of Mormon claims that this same Bible has been substantially corrupted and is therefore unreliable. In addition, Joseph Smith went so far as to actually create his own version of the Bible itself, the “Inspired Version,” in which he both adds and deletes significant portions of text, claiming he is “correcting” it. In so doing he also changes many doctrines, introducing his own in their place.

  • As a part of their new scriptural “spin,” both prophets saw themselves as prophesied in scripture, and both saw themselves as a continuation of a long line of Biblical prophets. Mohammed saw himself as a continuation of the ministry of Moses and Jesus. Joseph Smith saw himself as a successor to Enoch, Melchizedek, Joseph and Moses. Joseph Smith actually wrote himself into his own version of the Bible—by name.

  • Both prophets held up their own scripture as superior to the Bible. Mohammed claimed that the Koran was a perfect copy of the original which was in heaven. The Koran is therefore held to be absolutely perfect, far superior to the Bible and superceding it. In like manner, Joseph Smith also made the following claim. “I told the Brethren that the Book of Mormon was the most correct of any book on earth, and the keystone of our religion, and a man would get nearer to God by abiding its precepts, than by any other book.”[3]

  • Despite their claim that the Bible was corrupt, both prophets admonished their followers to adhere to its teachings. An obvious contradiction, this led to selective acceptance of some portions and wholesale rejection of others. As a result, the Bible is accepted by both groups of followers only to the extent that it agrees with their prophet’s own superior revelation.

  • Both Mohammed and Joseph Smith taught that true salvation was to be found only in their respective religions. Those who would not accept their message were considered “infidels,” pagans or Gentiles. In so doing, both prophets became the enemy of genuine Christianity, and have led many people away from the Christ of the Bible.

  • Both prophets encountered fierce opposition to their new religions and had to flee from town to town because of threats on their lives. Both retaliated to this opposition by forming their own militias. Both ultimately set up their own towns as model societies.

  • Both Mohammed and Joseph Smith left unclear instructions about their successors. The majority of Mohammed’s followers, Sunni Muslims, believe they were to elect their new leader, whereas the minority, Shiite Muslims, look to Alī ibn Abī Ṭālib, whom they consider Divinely appointed, as the rightful successor to Muhammad, and the first imam. (Ali was the cousin and son-in-law of the Islamic prophet Muhammad). Similarly, the majority of Joseph Smith's followers, Mormons, believed their next prophet should have been the existing leader of their quorum of twelve apostles, whereas the minority, RLDS, believed Joseph Smith's own son should have been their next prophet. Differences on this issue, and many others, have created substantial tension between these rival groups of each prophet.

  • Mohammed taught that Jesus was just another of a long line of human prophets, of which he was the last. He taught that he was superior to Christ and superceded Him. In comparison, Joseph Smith also made the following claim.

“I have more to boast of than ever any man had. I am the only man that has ever been able to keep a whole church together since the days of Adam. A large majority of the whole have stood by me. Neither Paul, John, Peter, nor Jesus ever did it. I boast that no man ever did such a work as I. The followers of Jesus ran away from Him, but the Latter-day Saints never ran away from me yet.”[4] In light of these parallels, perhaps Joseph Smith's claim to be a second Mohammed unwittingly became his most genuine prophecy of all.


[1] Joseph Smith made this statement at the conclusion of a speech in the public square at Far West, Missouri on October 14, 1838. This particular quote is documented in Fawn M. Brodie, No Man Knows My History, second edition, (New York: Alfred A. Knopf, 1971), p. 230–231. Fawn Brodie’s footnote regarding this speech contains valuable information, and follows. “Except where noted, all the details of this chapter [16] are taken from the History of the [Mormon] Church. This speech, however, was not recorded there, and the report given here is based upon the accounts of seven men. See the affidavits of T.B. Marsh, Orson Hyde, George M. Hinkle, John Corrill, W.W. Phelps, Samson Avard, and Reed Peck in Correspondence, Orders, etc., pp. 57–9, 97–129. The Marsh and Hyde account, which was made on October 24, is particularly important. Part of it was reproduced in History of the [Mormon] Church, Vol. III, p. 167. See also the Peck manuscript, p. 80. Joseph himself barely mentioned the speech in his history; see Vol. III, p. 162.”

[2] John Ankerberg & John Weldon, The Facts on Islam, (Eugene, OR: Harvest House Publishers, 1998), pp.8–9. Eric Johnson, Joseph Smith & Muhammed, (El Cajon, CA: Mormonism Research Ministry, 1998), pp. 6–7.

[3] Documentary History of the [Mormon] Church, vol.4, pp.461.

[4] Documentary History of the [Mormon] Church, vol.6, pp.408–409.




24 posted on 07/21/2012 2:18:32 PM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: Conservative Vermont Vet
Anyone with half a brain who's been paying attention to what 0bama and his cronies have been doing, knows full well that the islamist bastard needs to go. What more needs to be said about that douche?

OTOH,

This is a CONSERVATIVE forum, not just a "National Security" forum. There are many other issues with which CONSERVATIVES find themselves engaged in based on what they prioritize. The right to life being one of the more vocal.

Romney has shown that he will do that which is politically expedient at the moment in order to secure the votes needed for him to continue his advance.

"They always from their opposition bases solely on "Social Issues" and NEVER about National Security which IMHO trumps all else."

These are the issues that trouble those who are not pro-Romney or AB0. Abortion, 2nd Amendment, homosexuality, healthcare, etc. Romney's record on these is abysmal.

On your last "point", we're just going to have to disagree. IMHO, one's eternal salvation "...trumps all else."

Man may take your life, but the devil will take your soul.

30 posted on 07/21/2012 3:57:09 PM PDT by SZonian (Throwing our allegiances to political party's in the long run gave away our liberty.)
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