Posted on 07/03/2012 8:28:08 AM PDT by EBH
Telly Hudgins has been stopped and frisked by the police too many times to count in the Brownsville, New York, public housing project where he lives. One occasion sticks in his memory. "I had my pajamas on and my slippers on and I'm emptying my garbage" at the trash chute. "They asked me for ID to prove I lived there. Who walks around in their pajamas with ID?" asked the black, 35-year-old counselor for the mentally handicapped. He says he complained about the search and was issued a summons for disorderly conduct.
Deborah Richardson, 60, a black postal worker, has delivered mail in east Brooklyn's Brownsville for 14 years. She takes a different view of the New York Police Department's contentious Stop, Question and Frisk policy. "I'd like to see more stops and frisks," she said, leaning out of her postal truck. "This is a dangerous neighborhood. I won't even go up in those monstrosities anymore," she said, gesturing toward one of the towering housing complexes where she once pushed a mail cart. After four years of what she says was harassment from residents, many waiting for welfare checks, she got a transfer to a parcel truck delivery route.
For nearly two months the NYPD's stop-and-frisk policy has drawn New York City into an emotional debate about race, policing and Fourth Amendment rights. Mayor Michael Bloomberg and Police Commissioner Ray Kelly have fiercely defended the program against an onslaught of criticism from judges, civil rights leaders and a vocal block of Democratic politicians. It has become a defining issue for next year's mayoral election.
(Excerpt) Read more at news.yahoo.com ...
It doesn’t matter what the law is. A cop can murder you and his word is more credible than most any witnesses.
Cops can do anything they want unless they know a camera is around. And even then, the tape often ends up “lost” or the equipment “broken” during the investigation.
Make sure you have a hidden camera that automatically records to a remote server before you challenge them. You might win the lottery and scare some dirty cops.
Now look at this NYPD dirtbag. He got a slap on the wrist for ruining people’s lives over a quota. Most likely it was a deal to keep him quiet about the corrupt NYPD. The only reason he got caught is the drug lab engraved the drugs with micro lettering. The lab saw the same sample from this cop twice…
A frisk is a search. A very limited search, but still a search. Calling it a frisk doesn’t make it any less of a 4th Amendment violation.
I’m willing to help law enforcement, but that only goes so far. Get rude, abusive, or demeaning, or act like the Constitutional is on a roll in your bathroom, and watch my cooperation evaporate.
“Last I saw, it was a table with two NYPD and two TSA, in view of the token booth.”
That’s what I didn’t know what you meant.
Here’s prevailing law wrt NY directly. Surprisingly, things haven’t progressed very far yet. Note this kid actually had a weapon, but there wasn’t enough reasonable suspicion so the conviction was tossed on appeal.
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/06/27/nyregion/appeals-court-calls-a-stop-and-frisk-illegal.html?_r=1
Google “Terry stop” for more info on the legality in general. Terry stops are quick detention for an outer-clothing frisk done when a police officer has reasonable suspicion that you are illegally armed. It’s done for their and other’s safety. In the Terry case, reasonable suspicion came from an anonymous phone call, so the cop should be able to give you something if it’s a legal request.
Terry vs Ohio....people...this has been through the courts so many times it could be likened to a NY Subway turnstile.
If a policeman sees you committing a crime (even a “minor” one like trespassing) or believes you may be committing that crime, or have just finished committing that crime, that policeman can lawfally stop you.
If that policeman can articulate a legitimate reason to believe you may be concealing a weapon then the officer has a lawful right to pat your outgarments for weapons.
That is a “Terry Stop” or what NY is calling “stop and frisk”.
Unless you're in a place where people forfeit their 4th Amendment rights (airport, courthouse, driving in a car down the street, etc), you have to have reasonable suspicion for the stop itself. The Fourth Amendment prohibits searches AND seizures. Call it a frisk or a search--where is your reasonable suspicion to stop (seize) me?
One who doesn't think he was sufficiently grovelled to.
I need to stop getting Hiibel and Terry mixed up...
There are many factors that can make up reasonable suspicion. To name a few: furtive hand movements, evidence that you are ‘casing’ a location, change of direction upon seeing police, being in a drug-prone location, matching an eyewitness description for a crime recently committed, being pointed out by a witness. There are a lot of factors that when added up in the totality of circumstance could very easily warrant a stop and question. And, if advisable, a quick frisk of outer garments for weapons.
Take it from this NYC cop. You can give a DisCon summonse to a ham sandwich and it’ll hold up in court. It takes about 3 minutes to write one and they are good tickets to write.
Brother Bloomers just lookin’ out fo’ the fokes.
I don’t disagree with you, but you have to have reasonable suspicion for the stop. Taking your garbage out in your pajamas—assuming that is the full extent of the story—is not reasonable suspicion to justify a seizure, no matter in which neighborhood you live. People that live in crappy neighborhoods don’t forfeit fourth amendment protections merely by virtue of where they live.
That is exactly what I was referring to. The law means nothing to cops these days and the legal system makes no effort whatsoever to restrain them. Frankly, I'm way beyond giving a damn when one gets fragged along the way.
So, you’re fine with a cop being murdered but you’re not ok with cops stopping someone for 3 minutes if there is reasonable suspicion that the person has committed or is about to commit a crime. You sound like a total j/o, IMHO.
IMHO.
Hey now lay off, he is a Republican.</sarcasm>
Why should he have a problem with it even you have said that it is acceptable for a cop to kill a citizen
To: Ratman83
Is it wrong? Yes. Is it acceptable? Yes.
Life (and death) ain't always butterflies and rainbows.
170 posted on Wednesday, February 16, 2011 3:32:12 PM by thefactor (yes, as a matter of fact, i DID only read the excerpt) [ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 167 | View Replies | Report Abuse] ________________________________________
So a Terry Stop is lawless behavior? Take it up with the Supreme Court. They seem to disagree. Along with every other court in the country.
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