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Rubio’s bill would create a new class of visa for illegal aliens brought here as children. I said that it’s *like* a student visa (and it is, since it doesn’t create a path to citizenship), but it isn’t a student visa like the one that exists today. IIRC, the special visa would also allow the recipient to work in the U.S., but it is not a green card (so it would not create a path to citizenship) nor is it an H1B visa (so it wouldn’t depend on an employer requesting the visa for the recipient).

So what you're saying is that you want to create a whole new class of people who have a special status here in the U. S., that don't have to adhere to our laws. You know, maybe that's a great idea. I'll just sit down and start making a list of the special circumstances I want that apply to me, and screw the rest of you. You play by the rules, and I and the Hispanic illegal aliens can have our own special status.

The level of ignorance displayed here is astounding.

What's the matter, is this nation not becoming official diversified fast enough for you?

What do we tell the Australians, the Asians, the Europeans, and the Africans, when they complain that we have two sets of immigration laws, one for Hispanics and one for everybody else?

When it comes to you bleeding heart liberals, what about them? Do we just sign on to take the riff-raff from around the world in mass? Should we shoot for 2 billion people here in twenty years?

Is it really that difficult for you to understand that what Rubio is proposing is something new? You keep demonizing what Rubio has proposed and said without even taking the time to read and think about it.

I've been thinking about this since before 1986. How about you?

We have laws on the books and we don't enforce them. Now you support Rubio coming up with more laws we won't enforce. Then you blame me for telling it like it is.

And now you insult not just Senator Rubio, but me.

Frankly, the two of you are embarrassing yourselves. Don't blame me for pointing out what you're up to here.

You don't like the idea of illegal immigrants having a tough time now that they've come here and have no official status, so you want to cut them some slack and fix it.

HELL NO! This is fixed by them going home.

No, I did not join FR in November 2002 (I signed up right after the general election (but before the Senate runoff in LA) after having lurked for awhile) so as to become an “agent provocateur” for liberals 10 years later.

I don't care if you were the first member of F. R. I disagree with rewriting the laws of our nation to help folks who don't respect our nation enough to come here legally. And as for people brought here as children, I didn't do it. Our citizens didn't do it. Our government didn't do it. Their mommy and daddy did. Let them explain to their children the totally screwed up situation they ushered them into. Deport these people and be done with it. Crime doesn't pay. We have no obligation whatsoever to these people. I am sorry they find themselves in this predicament, but that's where it ends. I did not do it to them. Their family did.

It’s funny how you reflexively insult me and accuse me of being a liberal, when I’ve consistently said that *I don’t even like Rubio’s bill*.

If you don't like Rubio's bill, why are we having this conversation? Here, this is what you wrote above.

Rubio’s bill would create a new class of visa for illegal aliens brought here as children. I said that it’s *like* a student visa (and it is, since it doesn’t create a path to citizenship), but it isn’t a student visa like the one that exists today. IIRC, the special visa would also allow the recipient to work in the U.S., but it is not a green card (so it would not create a path to citizenship) nor is it an H1B visa (so it wouldn’t depend on an employer requesting the visa for the recipient).

You don't even grasp that you explained his bill in terms that defend it. Then you state, "I've consistently said that I dont' even like his bill." Well, except for when you defend his bill, you do consistantly say you don't like it.

Tell me again how I'm trying to make you look bad. Nope, you're doing it to yourself.

However, I recognnize (having read polls and not sticking my head in the sand) that it’s smart politics for him to cut the Democrats off at the pass and propose something that takes the whole “those poor kids brought here through no fault of their own” meme away from the Democrats without creating a path to citizenship, which is why the Democrats (particularly Obama) will do anything to stop the bill from getting to the floor.

Right now there are at least three polls linked from this forum. Even the wigged out Leftist rag Washington Post poll is 65/35 against what Obama said yesterday. Another poll is 75/25 against Obama. Then you describe others as having stuck their head in the sand. Well, at least we don't have our heads where yours, Rubio's, and Romney's is.

And if you can’t understand this, sorry, but I can’t do anything for you.

Go spread this manure on DU. It's stinkin up the place here.

Given that you’re obviously too stupid to understand what I wrote, I won’t hold your acrimony and insults against you.

I’ll type slower for your benefit. I don’t like Rubio’s bill. However, I’m not going to stay silent while people like you defame a conservative U.S. Senator by lying about what his bill says and does.

I also am mature enough to know that sometimes things that I don’t support are actually smart politics, since we have these things called elections, and we conservatives are not the only ones allowed to vote. The notion of deporting an 18-year-old college-bound high school senior who has lived in the U.S. since the age of two because his parents snuck him across the border illegally is not very popular among American voters. You point to polls in which solid majorities oppose Obama’s power grab (I’ll take your word for that—when I clicked on the link you provided to a Washington Post article, I didn’t find any polls), but a huge chunk of the population opposes when a president breaks the law, and another huge chunk opposes a plan that leaves open the possibility of providing amnesty for illegal aliens down the road such as Obama’s executive order, but unfortunately that does not mean that 65%+ of the population wants to deport college-bound high-schoolers or recent college graduates who have lived in the U.S. since the age of two. The Democrats want to use those more sympathetic cases to try to shove amnesty down our throats, and Rubio cleverly outmaneuvered them by proposing the Republican DREAM Act, which does not create a path to citizenship. The fact that Obama and the Democrats are fighting it tooth and nail tells you something about what it does (take an issue away from the Democrats) and doesn’t do (provide them with a path to citizenship). As I’ve said repeteadly, I would rather give the illegal aliens nothing (which is an easy position to take, since I’m not the one looking at polls and campaigning and fundraising every day to bring a Republican majority to the Senate), but I’m not going to lie about the bill just because I would rather not have it pass, nor will I stand pat while others lie about it.

Oh, and another tthing. Neither the Rubio bill nor the Obama unconstitutional executive order differentiates between Hispanic and non-Hispanic illegal aliens. Your bigoted little diatribe about how it’s one set of rules for Hispanics and one for everyone else is even more embarrassing than your non-sequiturs regarding the effect of the special visas provided by Rubio’s bill. If you want to start a political movement with the goal of getting rid of Hispanics from the U.S., you’re in the wrong forum. I am the first person to defend opponents of illegal immigration when they are unfairly accused of being anti-Hispanic bigots, but your statements about Rubio’s bill treating Hispanics one way and non-Hispanics another way make it pretty clear that you do not deserve the benefit of the doubt.

Oh, and having been thinking about something since 1986 (the year in which President Reagan made the second worst mistake of his presidency (after nominating O’Connor): signing an illegal alien amnesty bill into law that did create a path to citizenship) doesn’t give you any special understanding of bills that you reflexively dismiss without even bothering to find out what’s in them. I know, reading is hard, and so is thinking. But that’s what separates educated conservatives from bigots who have to resort to accusing fellow conservatives of being liberal agents. (And, no, saying “go back to DU” does not make you clever, much less right.)