Posted on 04/05/2012 8:34:17 PM PDT by sukhoi-30mki
Britain's Royal Air Force considering purchase of Israeli unmanned aerial vehicle
U.K. looking at the Eitan system, also known as the Heron TP - the largest and most sophisticated drone Israel makes.
LONDON - Britain's Royal Air Force has been considering the purchase of unmanned aerial vehicles from Israel.
The Eitan, also known as the Heron TP, is the largest and most sophisticated drone Israel makes. It is assembled by Israel Aerospace Industries and began operational service in the Israel Air Force two years ago, in a new squadron at the Tel Nof airbase.
The Eitan's wingspan is as wide as a Boeing 737 airliner and it can stay in the air for up to forty hours, carrying out long-range missions at 40 thousand feet, hundreds of kilometers away from base, broadcasting back real-time footage of wide areas. According to foreign sources, the Eitan also carries out missions over Iran.
Israeli and British security sources have confirmed in recent days that the Royal Air Force has been considering buying a number of Eitan systems, since the Mantis, a joint British-French unmanned strategic project, has been delayed and will not be operational before 2020.
No official request has yet been made by the British Ministry of Defense and for now, the RAF is only making initial examinations and is also considering American UAVs and continuing its manned surveillance flights while waiting for the Mantis.
A purchase of an Israeli military system will surely cause protests by pro-Palestinian organizations. Today, Israel buys very little military products from Britain due to export limits placed in the past by the British foreign ministry.
If the RAF selects the Eitan, it will be the second Israeli UAV bought by the British,
(Excerpt) Read more at haaretz.com ...
UK sold a lot of Eurofighter typhoons with Storm Shadows cruise missiles to Saudi Arabia. I dont think Israel should sell them squat.
You do realise that the US sells more arms to the Saudis than Britain or anyone else don’t you?
US also gives $4 million dollars in aid to Israel. How much does the UK give to Israel?
Correction: $4 BILLION dollars each year
I don’t know and I don’t care. This is about business, not aid or charity. Israeli Aerospace Industries Ltd is going to be paid by the British MOD for their product, and the Israeli defence industry needs foreign customers to pay for their stuff in order to continue to be able to fund their future development world-leading military hardware.
If the Israeli’s wanted to get all butthurt about Britain selling stuff to the Saudis and not paying them off like the Americans do, they could refuse to sell to us, but Britain is more than capable of producing an equivalent piece of equipment itself (and is doing, with the Taranis project) and buying a stopgap from somewhere else in the meantime. Israel has more to gain from this deal than Britain does, ultimately...
I don’t know and I don’t care. This is about business, not aid or charity. Israeli Aerospace Industries Ltd is going to be paid by the British MOD for their product, and the Israeli defence industry needs foreign customers to pay for their stuff in order to continue to be able to fund their future development world-leading military hardware.
If the Israeli’s wanted to get all butthurt about Britain selling stuff to the Saudis and not paying them off like the Americans do, they could refuse to sell to us, but Britain is more than capable of producing an equivalent piece of equipment itself (and is doing, with the Taranis project) and buying a stopgap from somewhere else in the meantime. Israel has more to gain from this deal than Britain does, ultimately...
This is from the article :
“Today, Israel buys very little military products from Britain due to export limits placed in the past by the British foreign ministry. “
I think time for Israel to place some “export limits”. I dont think Israel will miss the puny British arms market all that much.
“I don’t know and I don’t care.”
You brought up the point about US selling to Saudi. You should know and you should care.
This isn't a contest about who is the biggest Israelophile, Britain wants to buy something from Israel, and Israel wants to sell. They can sell to us, or they can cut their noses off to spite their face and not sell it to us.
It would actually be in Israel's interests to engage us in more trade like this, because at the moment, Britain has more trade interests with the likes of Saudi Arabia than with Israel, which is why it is often reluctant to take a pro-Israeli line.
Israel should be hawking its military hardware and other products to as many other nations as possible and making itself indispensable in order to give these nations a vested interest in supporting Israel politically.
Right now, the reason why most countries in the world indulge the Arabs in their constant butthurt over Israel and Palestine is because they have most of the oil their economies depended on and they aren't above using that fact to wield political and diplomatic influence(aremember the oil crisis in 1973, when OAPEC threw their teddies out of the pram over western support of Israel during the Yom Kippur War?)
Israel is the last country in the world that has the luxury of being able to alienate other countries out of spite. The oil-rich Arab nations and Iran have that luxury to a large extent, which is one of the why the latter has been flipping the bird to the west for so long and getting away with it. Israel's unfavourable strategic position means that needs to make friends and influence people, not piss them off.
This isn't a contest about who is the biggest Israelophile, Britain wants to buy something from Israel, and Israel wants to sell. They can sell to us, or they can cut their noses off to spite their face and not sell it to us.
It would actually be in Israel's interests to engage us in more trade like this, because at the moment, Britain has more trade interests with the likes of Saudi Arabia than with Israel, which is why it is often reluctant to take a pro-Israeli line.
Israel should be hawking its military hardware and other products to as many other nations as possible and making itself indispensable in order to give these nations a vested interest in supporting Israel politically.
Right now, the reason why most countries in the world indulge the Arabs in their constant butthurt over Israel and Palestine is because they have most of the oil their economies depended on and they aren't above using that fact to wield political and diplomatic influence(aremember the oil crisis in 1973, when OAPEC threw their teddies out of the pram over western support of Israel during the Yom Kippur War?)
Israel is the last country in the world that has the luxury of being able to alienate other countries out of spite. The oil-rich Arab nations and Iran have that luxury to a large extent, which is one of the why the latter has been flipping the bird to the west for so long and getting away with it. Israel's unfavourable strategic position means that she needs to make friends and influence people, not piss them off.
And if you do..... then explain to me why UK is ok putting “export limits” on Israel buying arms .....but Israel shouldn't deny sale to UK?
Britain is half the reason why anti-semitism has gained so much popularity in the western world. Britain has actively been encouraging anti-semitism and Muslim radicalism for decades. You are saying a little trade will fix all of that now that Britain needs UAVs?
And Israel shouldn't alienate UK? You think Israel will cease to exist if they don't make this sale? And what friends/allies does UK have in the world? South America? Arab/Muslim world?
Yes Israel should be hawking their military hardwares to as many nations .....but not to enemies.
I only made the point because of your hypocrisy in criticizing Britain for selling weapons hardware to the Saudis when the US was and is doing more of the exact same thing, and when I pointed this out you are trying to justify your hypocrisy by boasting about how much your government is donating to Israel at the American taxpayer’s expense, as if I should care. Even if the US wasn’t selling to the Saudis and the British were, it doesn’t even matter,
because Israel has more to gain from selling its stuff to other nations, (including Britain) than it does by not doing.
At the end of the day, Britain isn’t a tiny country on a small strip of coastal land surrounded on all sides by hostile nations eager to see its destruction. Britain’s geographical location is pretty good compared to Israel’s. The worst we get from our immediate neighbours is that they sometimes say mean things about our cooking prowess and drinking habits when we irritate them at football matches and EU summits. In Israel, their neighbours invoke chilling blood libels and pray to their moon god for the wholesale genocide of their citizens.
Israel would benefit more from Britain’s goodwill and friendship than Britain would from Israel’s. If Israel adopted your pointless policy of boycotting Britain, it would be petty and self-defeating. Israel needs to fight against diplomatic isolation, not increase it further.
Israel would actually benefit and gain influence over Britain by providing it with some of its military hardware. Right now, influence over Britain rests predominantly with the Arabs today because our trading links with the Arabs are more significant than they are with the Israelis.
You don’t seem quite able to grasp the fact that Israel’s strategic position means that they need to be doing everything they can mitigate the strategic influence the Arab world has with Britain and other nations, because the way things are at the moment, Britain has more vested interests in supporting the Arabs politically than they do the Israelis.
Right now, it serves Britain’s interests to make the gesture of implementing half-arsed embargos on exports to Israel whenever the Arabs get butthurt with Israel over something. If Israel was responsible for supplying Britain with important military hardware, Britain might not be so quick to jump on the pro-arab bandwagon whenever things kick off in the Gaza Strip. In actual fact, a school of thought might suggest that it isn’t in Britain’s interests to create such a conflict of interest by buying this Israeli hardware. If it wasn’t for the fact that my sympathies tend to be pro-Israel and utterly contemptuous of most Arab nations (particularly Saudi Arabia) I would not be happy at all about the prospect of Britain buying Israeli military gear and building up a trade relationship of this nature with them...
Britain is not an antisemitic country.
Where do people like you come up with crap like that?. I have read JDL reports that show UK anti-semitic incidents falling as American rates rise. So is your country anti-semitic?.
Puny?.
The UK arms market is worth $1054 million. And we are the fifth biggest arms exporter.
None.
It deals with Israel as an ally, and sells £xbillion of arms to Israel every year. It DID give aid to Israel until 1999.
Do you realize the word “market” applies to you only if you are “buying”....i.e “importing” not “exporting”? Where does UK rank in terms of arms import?
Britain traditionally has sold a lot of military equipment to the less volatile nations of the Middle East, particularly Jordan and Saudi Arabia. You sell them equipment, you have a certain amount of control over them.
Anyway, the US sells military equipment to Saudi.
There are people on FR who are so obsessively and supinely pro-Israeli that any position other than absolute and total unconditional support for Israel and everything they do is perceived and written up as "antisemitic" (and possibly even treasonous). It's the same kind of mentality that sees any objection to Gay Pride week as "homophobia", all criticism of Barack Obama as "racism", and any negative opinion of muslim practices as "Islamaphobia".
I've gotten into arguments over British-Israeli relations with such folk before. It's a waste of time and energy. Britain was stuck with the thankless task of juggling the rival ambitions of Jew and Arab in the Palestine Mandate, and inevitably not every decision went the Isrelis way. To the extreme pro-Israel wing that makes us an enemy. Every decision the British Foreign Office has made since that does not accord with total support for Israel further bolsters that opinion. Selling a weapon system to Saudi Arabia is purely a business transaction, but there is absolutely nothing you can say that will convince them of that. Two centuries from now (assuming the Human race is still going) their spiritual (and probably actual) descendents will be trotting out the same grievances, possibly attached to Biblical injunctions about the terrible consequences of "opposing God's chosen people, the apple of His eye." The fact that there is a divine rider upon the status of Jews as "God's chosen people" will be conveniently never stated, of course.
I humbly suggest it would be a more profitable use of your time to redirect your energies to other threads re Britain and the UK, and let this one go.
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