Russian Air Force Takes Upgraded Su-27s Intended for China

AIN Online ^ | January 20, 2012 | Vladimir Karnozov

[sukhoi-30mki]

Russian Air Force Takes Upgraded Su-27s Intended for China

AIN Defense Perspective » January 20, 2012

by Vladimir Karnozo

Sukhoi has delivered 12 Su-27SM(3)s to the Russian air force. The aircraft were originally intended to be supplied as subassemblies to China under a contract signed in 2009, and the last delivery was made in late December. The airframes were assembled at Sukhoi’s KnAAPO plant in Komsomolsk-on-Amur from parts originally manufactured for what was meant to be a second batch of 95 airframes in the Chinese order for 200 Su-27SKs. However, China took only the first 105 Su-27SKs, most of which were assembled in China from Russian kits.

The Su-27SM(3) is a single-seat multirole fighter capable of air superiority and ground strike missions. The Russian air force has already upgraded a considerable number of its Su-27 fighters to the SM standard. The SM(3) has a stronger airframe than previous SM variants, allowing the manufacturer to increase mtow by more than 2,000 pounds. It has additional hard points for weapons carriage. The heavier weight is offset by higher-thrust AL-31F-M1 engines manufactured by MMPP Salut. As an added bonus, these engines have extended service life.

The Su-27SM(3) also features a new electronic warfare suite and improved targeting systems. The weapons package includes new missiles (Sukhoi declined to specify the type) and the air-to-air and air-to-surface missiles in the Su-27SM(3) arsenal have longer firing ranges. Furthermore, the Su-27SM(3) can use modern precision guidance munitions guided by Glonass/GPS. Finally, the company has added the KIS “comprehensive information system,” which monitors the condition of onboard systems to make maintenance easier.

The cockpits of previous Su-27SM variants were based on dial instruments. But the SM(3) has a modern glass cockpit with four liquid-crystal MFDs in lieu of 13 “steam gauges” on the original Su-27S. The onboard communications complex is jam-proof and provides a secure datalink with ground command posts and airborne assets. According to Sukhoi the Su-27SM(3) is more than twice as effective against aerial targets and three times more effective against ground targets than the Su-27S.

The Russian air force exhibited a Su-27SM(3) at the Moscow Air Show last August, but at the time did not specify how it differed from earlier SM variants.

[sukhoi-30mki]

The latest upgrade to the Su-27 fighter was displayed at the Moscow Air Show last August. (Photo: Vladimir Karnozov)

[Chode]

doesn't say why, patent infringement???

[mosesdapoet]

Thanks for the posting. What caught my eye was the location of that manufaturing facility. If it’s on the Amur river. That is far far away from Moscow. Am I correct it’s much closer to Valdivostock and Manchuria/ N Korea than to NovoSibirsk ?

[Don Corleone]

If China is such a great industrial threat why are they buying technology from Russia. It would be like the USA buying aviation technology from say, Brazil. Oh wait....!

[sukhoi-30mki]

Yes, it’s in the Russian far east.

[sukhoi-30mki]

Unlikely, the Russians are still promoting advanced systems like the SU-35 to China.

I think it had to do with the fact that China has been able to fine-tune its own SU-27 variant, the J-11.

http://www.sinodefence.com/airforce/fighter/j11.asp

[Chode]

thx...

[Cringing Negativism Network]

“However, China took only the first 105 Su-27SKs, most of which were assembled in China from Russian kits. “

-

So in other words, China has now reverse engineered them, and has their own factory. No need for Russia now.

Soviet Union, meet “free trade”.

[hattend]

China has already reverse engineered the plane, they don’t need to buy anymore.

[hattend]

I should have scrolled down first.

[ponder life]

Soviet Union, meet “free trade”.

Well, yes. But contrary to the tone of all the other comments, it is the Russians who we should be suspicious of.

The Chinese are able to buy considerable resources from Australia, Brazil, Africa, the Middle East and soon Canada. And maybe even the US. But still, with the Russians, it has been a trickle of gas and oil. And the irony of the fact that Russia is on China's North borders. And we can see how the Russians play hardball by the fact that they cut off gas supplies to Europe a few years ago.

Seeing how the Chinese are able to cooperate with the others in resources, but not the Russians, tells me something about the Russians and not the Chinese.

I suspect, somewhere between the terms of the original 200 Su-27's, and the actual delivery, it was the Russians who double crossed the Chinese.

[cunning_fish]

In fact China reverse engineered carrier based version of Su-27 known as Su-33. There are videos available on youtube. I think it is pretty easy to build a land based fighter-bomber out of it.

[ponder life]

I don't doubt that the Chinese copied. But we seldom get the Chinese side of the story when it comes to disagreements with the Russians.

Also, keep in mind, there isn't anything illegal about copying manufactured products, as long you don't violate the time frame of the patents and repackage your product with a similar name and symbol.

The Su-27 was delivered in 1984. So it is not illegal to copy it as long as you don't copy any upgrades within the time frame of a legal patent.

That's why we have generic drugs, once a patent runs out on a drug, another manufacturer can copy the product and sell for much cheaper. As long as they don't repackage it using a similar name or symbol of the original manufacturer.

I don't doubt that there are patent violations in China. But there are also parts of copying that is legal. And the Chinese may have refused the final Su-27 because the Russians didn't offer them the latest version of the Su-27 (I admit, I'm speculating here). But I find it hard to believe, that the Russians are pure as the driven snow on this one. They seldom are when dealing with the rest of the world.

[cunning_fish]

To me it is not that much important. Working with Sukhoi kits given Chinese an idea on that is it a 4th gen fighter aircraft but they still unable to reproduce it’s 4th gen engines which is a 70s technology. At some point things are getting too advanced to copy&paste, you need complex knowledge to make it work.
China is decades too far from the edge which is a 5gen aircraft today.

[ponder life]

I don't doubt China has a long ways to go. They even admitted it themselves. But I do believe they will get the engine problem resolved.

Catching up with the West will likely take another 30 years (as the West isn't idle in development). But I do believe catching up with the Russians, i.e., can be done in about 10 years (I admit, I'm guessing here).

But its not like China don't have a jet engine available. But its not as durable as the Russian engines. An engine is made up of many parts rotating at tens of thousands of rpm's. And operating under intense heat and pressure. So, somewhere in copying, I'm sure the Chinese overlooked something that would allow it to last longer.

But I am confident they will find it. The challenge isn't catching up with the Russians. The challenge for China is catching up with the West in military technology. And that includes more than just engines, but integrating the high tech precision guide munitions to integrating land, sea and air systems. For all three to communicate in unison, etc. And to integrate it all via satellite technology. That, I believe, is where China's real challenge is. Not duplicating Russian engines.