Brevard County Sheriff's Office Raids Gun Conversion Manufacturer

newsbrevardtimes.com ^ | 3 Nov 2011 | unattributed

[smokingfrog]

First reported on BrevardTimes.com, the Brevard County Sheriff's Office raided a Cape Canaveral business located at 8700 Commerce Street at around 6:00 p.m. today.

Public records show that the business located at this address is that of Jonathan Arthur Ciener, Inc., a company that advertises gun conversion kits on www.22lrconversions.com.

On the Web, there appear to be several consumer complaints about www.22lrconversions.com.

Jonathan Arthur Ciener was arrested and charged with schemes to defraud less than $20,000, which is a third degree felony.

[smokingfrog]

Takes people's money without delivering the product.

[GlockThe Vote]

Wow!!!

I have one of those kits on my AR. I love it, but I have heard TONS AND TONS of complaints about this guy not delivering the goods as promised.

[hiredhand]

After doing some research prior to purchase, we decided not to purchase Ciener’s products because of feedback about his customer service. We purchased CMMG units instead. Apparently, TOO many people complained.

[GlockThe Vote]

i bought mine through a vendor since I heard so many horror stories about dealing w Cienor directly.

I love the kit for the AR though. Got a few mags at Brownells and good to go. save a ton of money.

[hiredhand]

The conversion kits are awesome! We really like ours. :-) ... you probably know this... but... I was wondering why the kits weren't very accurate. I mean, they're accurate "enough". But I discovered that the "average" twist rate on an AR-15 barrel is 1:9". The average twist rate on a .22 rimfire barrel is 1:16"!

I don't worry much about it for the distances we practice at. It makes shooting the AR cheap, and easy to train people who don't like the noise. :-)

[GlockThe Vote]

At 100 yards on Iron sights it is fine for its use.

[hiredhand]

Agreed...it's fine for that. I just happened to shoot against a friend who beat me no matter what at 75 yards using a Ruger 10/22. Ammo matters too... a LOT. The conversion kit likes 40gr solids. It does NOT like Remington ammo... even said so in the documentation! :-) It constantly malfunctions on their Yellow-Jacket ammo. Gotta run...I'll be back later.

[GlockThe Vote]

True! many duds w the Remington.

[IYAS9YAS]

True! many duds w the Remington.

I bought a Remington 597 .22LR and Remington ammo (Cyclone) to go with it. I should have opted for the Ruger 10/22 (which I later traded the Remington toward). Between the 597 and the ammo, I had a 10% fail-to-fire rate. I tried to fire off 100 rounds, and had 10 that didn't go bang.

After picking up the Ruger 10/22 I decided to feed it the Federal ammo. I was more than two thirds of the way through a 550 round box before the first misfire. All told, I've put almost 1,000 rounds through it, and had only two not go bang.

[GlockThe Vote]

I bought a GSG5 and have the same bs going on with it w cheap ammo

[Sir_Ed]

I really don’t get Ciener’s business plan...be rude to customers, make them wait a year or more, then often times don’t ever ship them their products.

If he knows he can’t make the kits, stop selling, or if he knows they’ll be delayed for a year or more, tell people that!

There’s lots of gunsmiths and holster makers who are backlogged a year or more, but they tell people that, and people pay for their product knowing that it’ll take a year or more...why on Earth didn’t Ciener do the same??

Ed

[IMR 4350]

I had the same problem with Remington .22 ammo no matter what I tried shooting it in, and Winchester brass, ,22LR and.22WMR, will split. It doesn't hurt anything in a single action revolver but sometimes it wont extract in a semi auto,.22LR, or in a bolt action .22WMR rifle.

[Myrddin]

But I discovered that the "average" twist rate on an AR-15 barrel is 1:9". The average twist rate on a .22 rimfire barrel is 1:16"!

The 1:9 is ideal for a 55 gr bullet. The typical .22LR is about a 40 gr bullet. That doesn't require as fast a twist, but 1:12 is probably optimal. 1:16 sounds too low for good stabilization. I tracked down a web page with common twist rates for T/C Encore/Contender barrels. The cite 1:16 for rimfire .22. Faster rates for center fire. See twist rates.

[hiredhand]

Have you had your conversion kit malfunction whereby a live round jams itself up into the TOP of the unit? It’s very irritating. That Remington ammo does this a LOT. The resolution is to just remove the bolt, or reach in with a Leatherman tool and PULL the stuck round out. :-)

[GlockThe Vote]

Yes - happens a lot. If i clean the unit frequently it does not happen. Also - important to pull trigger and let go!

It overfeeds if you dont let the trigger up.

[Myrddin]

I was really impressed with the build on the Magnum Research custom .22 rifle. The receiver is Ruger 10/22 based with a built-in Picatinny rail. It has the skeletonized stock in a very nice laminate and a carbon fiber barrel. That's where there happiness ended. I was getting misfires out of the box. It was light strikes. I purchased a different firing pin with more surface area where it contacts the rim and a stronger hammer spring. That fixed it. No more misfires. A beautifully balanced rifle. Click the picture for info. I just learned that Magnum Research was acquired by Kahr Arms.

[GlockThe Vote]

Agreed - he has a decent product and acts like that is unreal.

This has been going on for years BTW!

[hiredhand]

1:12 eh? That could be. We had one of those S&W M&P 22s... looks like an AR, but shoots the .22 rimfire. We read that it had a 1:16” twist and it was very, VERY accurate. Thanks for that link on the twist rates. I’ll look it over. :-)

[RedMDer]

Donate Today!

[NonValueAdded]

Brevard County, Florida ping.

Let me know if you want on or off this ping list.
(not associated with the county government)