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To: 4buttons

Poof, drugs are legalized. Now what’s the war with the cartels going to be called?

The criminality of drugs isn’t what grew the cartels or armed them, or made them into the horrid problem that Mexico has today. It has everything to do with the culture of Mexico which encouraged corruption in every level of government, from bribes to street officers to outright buying of army officers to steal weapons from the military.

Make it legal to have massive coca fields near the border, and those fields will be under the armed control of the cartels, and nothing will have changed. Make it legal for huge marijuana plantations, and again, they’ll simply be armed cartel camps.

It all comes down to a question of will. Does Mexico have the will to retain their country? I don’t think so. Too much time is spent blaming outside factors - it’s the drugs, it’s the guns, it’s...all the fault of Mexicans for permitting armed groups to take control of their country. Stop blaming others, and either take it back, or cede such territory to the cartels and move on.


4 posted on 10/22/2011 1:52:27 PM PDT by kingu (Everything starts with slashing the size and scope of the federal government.)
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To: kingu

They will attempt to do the same thing, except they will be missing a huge asset, one that got them syarted.

You’ll never get rid of bad people, just keep making it harder and harder for them to be bad. This would do it.


6 posted on 10/22/2011 1:56:19 PM PDT by stuartcr ("Everything happens as God wants it to...otherwise, things would be different.")
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To: kingu

To put a formal prohibition on something popular (even if it is harmful under common circumstances) severely taxes the resources of a government. You’d think this would have been learned from alcohol.


7 posted on 10/22/2011 1:57:07 PM PDT by HiTech RedNeck (There's gonna be a Redneck Revolution! (See my freep page) [rednecks come in many colors])
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To: kingu
The trafficking in drugs goes hand in hand with the trafficking of weapons.

Look for the BATF's new "Blasted and Befuddled" drug distribution network to go along with "Fast and Furious".

8 posted on 10/22/2011 1:57:33 PM PDT by Zuben Elgenubi
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To: kingu
Make alcohol legal, the cartels will set up armed distilleries. Legalize tobacco...

Oh wait, you say they don't make money from alcohol or tobacco? Now I wonder why that is.

It wouldn't be because a criminal black market can't compete with a well-regulated legal market, would it? Nah!

15 posted on 10/22/2011 2:16:23 PM PDT by Ken H (They are running out of other people's money. )
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To: kingu

Yes, bring out the troops and declare all out war and martial law. They can get it done under one year if they want to.


22 posted on 10/22/2011 2:28:46 PM PDT by fabian (" And a new day will dawn for those who stand long, and the forests will echo with laughter")
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To: kingu

“Make it legal to have massive coca fields near the border, and those fields will be under the armed control of the cartels, and nothing will have changed. Make it legal for huge marijuana plantations, and again, they’ll simply be armed cartel camps.”

Couple of minor points: Hate to invest in “massive coca fields” in northern Mexico, it won’t grow there; my drug lord would probably torture me thouroughly before killing me for suggesting such a waste of money.

Unlike oil, with legal status, America could become self-sufficient in pot or opium poppies almost overnight! No more dinero to cartels, terrorists or anyone abroad. I am reliably told that the finest quality pot in the world is grown here in the USA, some indoors, some in National Forests, never underestimate the ingenuity of the American entrepanuer!

More serious note: Elliot Ness did not end the alcohol-related violence and corruption spawned by Prohibition: the end of Prohibition did. Yeah, Ness took down Capone (on tax charges, not rum-running) after a two year effort and three more as bad or worse immediately jumped in. The ultimate speak-easy consumer probably never noticed the difference.

The criminality of drugs is EXACTLY what grew the cartels, and without that flow of illegal money they will wither away or shift to other businesses, possibly less lethal ones, as did American gangsters.

I want a shred of evidence the “War on Drugs” does anything save fatten the wrong pockets. Cocaine and heroin are cheaper, purer, and more available today than in 1980. Meth-heads can get their stuff more easily than I can get psuedophedrin in allergy season. Legalization will not result in any significant increase in use: ANYONE who wants ANYTHING can get it now.


25 posted on 10/22/2011 2:33:47 PM PDT by barkeep (Post Hoc, Ergo Propter Hoc)
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To: kingu

Regarding Marijuana, some simple economics:

Since MJ is a weed, it is as easy to grow as a tomato. So, domestic production would cripple foreign SMUGGLERS & the price of MJ would drop like a rock.

Current prices for MJ range from $300-$800 per ounce, or more. Dealing can be very lucrative. But, If someone can grow a pound or 2 (16-32 ounces) on their terrace in pots with a dollar packet of seeds & some MiracleGro, then pot becomes essentially free, putting the pot DEALERS & GROWERS out of business.

That is 3 major US criminal enterprises completely out of business. Permanently & almost immediately. Thousands of big & small dealers, growers, & smugglers gone because their customers can get it for free.

If something is free, it has no commercial value, & little human appeal.

Two responses I always get when I address this:

1. The entire country will become pot heads

2. It will destroy the children

My answers:

1. Those people who prefer to smoke pot probably already are. Also, ask your friends & relatives if they would smoke pot if it were legal. Likely, if they don’t smoke it now, they wont when legal.

2. Children should not use ANY drugs w/o a doctor’s supervision. Parents must hold & take complete responsibility, with schools providing a supporting/monitoring role. Subjecting your child to the criminal justice system will NOT solve the problems that led to drug use - it will multiply them. Criminalization doesn’t work with adults either, as our bulging jails & nearly 100 year War on Drugs attest to.


41 posted on 10/22/2011 4:27:27 PM PDT by Mister Da (The mark of a wise man is not what he knows, but what he knows he doesn't know!)
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To: kingu
“Poof, drugs are legalized. Now what’s the war with the cartels going to be called?”

OVER!

With drugs legalized, the Cartel's incomes would be drastically reduced. Cartels cost big money. Fighters, smugglers, crooked pols & police, etc. don't work for free. Cartels cannot survive on the remaining criminality - smuggling illegals, prostitution, & the like.

Legalization would dramatically reduce the price of street drugs. The junkie who needs to steal $500 a day to maintain his habit may only need to steal $50 a day, or nothing if given the obvious medical attention he really needs. Marijuana can be grown in a pot in Manhattan, so forget plantations in Mexico. Coca & opium have climate/soil requirements. “Kitchen-cooked” drugs can be made anywhere.

All-in-all, the cartels would be OUT of the drug business shortly after US legalization.

I do NOT favor the complete legalization of all drugs, especially “kitchen-cooked” drugs, though I do favor the decriminalization of marijuana. From youthful experience, I know it to be relatively harmless, & certainly less dangerous than alcohol or jail.

45 posted on 10/22/2011 5:13:44 PM PDT by Mister Da (The mark of a wise man is not what he knows, but what he knows he doesn't know!)
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To: kingu
"Now what’s the war with the cartels going to be called?"

democracy

48 posted on 10/23/2011 7:54:18 AM PDT by Designer (Nit-pickin' and chagrinin')
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