Posted on 10/08/2011 4:09:26 PM PDT by Clairity
The real political defect of the Cain plan is that it imposes a new national sales tax while maintaining the income tax. Mr. Cain's rates are seductively low, but the current income tax was introduced in 1913 with a top rate of 7% amid promises that it would never exceed 10%. By 1918 the top rate was 77%.
Part of Mr. Cain's appeal is his willingness to challenge political convention, and he certainly has with his tax proposal. Voters like that he isn't a lifetime politician but a successful business owner who has met a payroll and created jobs. But his endorsement of a sales tax on top of the income tax is a political gamble that would eventually finance an even larger entitlement state. Better to reform the devil we know—the income tax—than to introduce another devil and end up with ever-rising rates of both.
(Excerpt) Read more at online.wsj.com ...
What’s the basis for your conclusion that this plan will raise fewer revenues?
IIRC, Art Laffer said Cain’s plan will raise more revenue.
Exactly, and well said.
Huck, did you miss the part about seeing how the actual legislation addressed this point?
Same thing can be said about the Ryan plan or any other. Once you’ve established what you want to do, then you have to figure out what it takes to make it - so far as possible - permanent.
And those claiming Cain’s plan shouldn’t be considered because Congress can raise taxes in the future — um, as you just pointed out, isn’t it true that, no matter what we do, Congress can still raise taxes in the future?
So, yes, this is a strawman argument. It’s a point that needs to be and will be addressed. But it’s not a show-stopper.
I’d gladly pay a tax on my purchases, which I control beyond necessities, in exchange for not only a lower personal income tax rate, but a rate that is the same for everyone and the demise of the tax code, which would get rid of lobbying for deductions, etc.
Know why Libs DON’T want a national sales tax? Because it gives the power of the purse to the people. They can easily and directly affect how much money the federal beast gets simply by changing their spending habits.
Libs hate that. They don’t want people to have a better means of starving the beast. They want to put people in the box of having to earn less income if they don’t want to pay more taxes.
An Obama guy said as much, too.
THANK YOU.
Some people are acting as though Congress can’t increase taxes now or at any time in the future.
This is not a problem that is unique to the Cain plan.
And, cc, you’ve got it exactly right: if EVERYONE were paying taxes at the same rate, the pols could not pit the poor against the rich or use any other crap sandwich argument to raise rates on some and pick winners and losers in the tax code.
If pols wanted to raise the income tax, ALL constituents of EVERY Congresscritter would be affected. Think that wouldn’t make a difference, anyone?
Please explain that to President Eisenhower.
Current example:
One of the myriad reasons the Senate Dems are stalling on Obama’s “Jobs” Act is that it raises taxes on the oil and gas industries.
Dem Senators from oil and gas states simply will not vote for it.
Why? They don’t want to get their butts handed to them on Election Day. I.e., self-interest.
As we’ve been pointing out, under a plan such as Cain’s, EVERY Congresscritter’s constituents would be affected by ANY tax increase, because everybody would pay the same rate.
See above.
I read your comments as really going to the process — the best way to implement and embed permanently the plan.
That’s a very good discussion to have. But some people seem to confuse “if the process seems hard or murky right now” then “the plan is idiotic.”
See my post#175
Which of the following held elected public office prior to being elected president?
a) Washington
b) Eisenhower
c) Cain (2012)
d) None of the above
Answer d) which means none had "executive experience in government" until after they began serving as president.
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Send treats to the troops...
Great because you did it.
www.AnySoldier.com
(An entirely free service)
Kinda like George Washington, eh?
And President Eisenhower.
Love the Hermanator, but the last person elected President with NO elective office experience was Eisenhower, and he only, y'know, won WWII
Actually, your example proves the opposite of your conclusion!
Spousal unit and I were talking about this today while reading something about the "Corrupt Bargain" that put Rutherford B. Hayes into the White House.
We got on to Herman Cain and the fact that he had no elected experience and that last time that happened was probably Ike.
Then I said (my point here, finally!) - the thing about the presidency is that there is no fixed resume that the person should have. There are times when the president MUST have an unusual background, precisely because it is necessary to have a President that is unique for the times.
Ike was elected this way. He wasn't elected because he was a popular general. He was elected because the United States still had a lot of mopping up to do with the WWII, including figuring out our new military-industrial posture in the world (the U.S. had not been a Superpower until WWII), figuring out occupied Europe and Japan.
Ike had run a large organization -- the U.S. military -- and after the war the U.S. needed a President who knew how to run things, "move, shoot and communicate" as they say in the Army. Ike had helped transition from war to peace in the military and had helped stand down the wartime machines. Likewise the country now needed to make the transition from wartime to peacetime, all the while still having considerable mop-up duties around the world.
So Ike was elected because he was the right man FOR THE TIMES. He had the skill set and experience to address the unique issues facing the country at that time.
Cain is an accomplished, experienced, successful businessman who is also a great communicator and someone who CAN (unlike Obama) shift the topic of race, finally, into the 21st century. We need someone who knows how to run a business, who understands from experience the real economy. Sure, it's not WWII-level experience, but we don't need someone with Ike's skills now. Business, financial, real economy experience and skills are what we need NOW.
We may just be at one of those relatively rare points in history where there is a man who should be elected because, like Ike, he's right for the times he lives in.
“People anxious to jump on the Cain bandwagon may want to take a closer look at the man and his planned policies. “
The Wall Street Journal editorial board is the DEFINITION of the Republican Establishment. Obviously they’re much happier with Romney or Perry than Cain.
...and that just suits me FINE.
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Send treats to the troops...
Great because you did it.
www.AnySoldier.com
(An entirely free service)
This attitude of not passing something because of what some future legislature might do is a recipe for being frozen in place. Roosevelt knew what he was doing when he put a graduated income tax in place just as he did when he initiated Social Security. Democrats lie to get their socialist policies in place. That is the history of the Left.
Cain’s plan is the beginning of the transition from the present tax system to the Fair Tax and the elimination of the IRS. We should all support it.
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Send treats to the troops...
Great because you did it.
www.AnySoldier.com
(An entirely free service)
That is just what this country needs, a new form of tax (a sales tax) in addition to the income tax. Why didn’t Bush think of this? Maybe he did to finance his perpetual war in Afghanistan or his nearly $4 trillion increase in the national debt.
We already have a sales tax in our state. Why would I vote for more sales tax for big government? No thanks Mr. Cain, you don’t have to give the slippery congress critters another tax so that they can ratchet up your 9% to 35% or more.
Silver platter my arse!
You can’t get anything right. Cain hasn’t been elected to anything and he will NEVER be elected President. You pinhead.
You need some serious schooling. You didn’t know that the military is part of the government. LOL
Herman Cain is running for President. He's not a career politician (in fact he has never held political office). He's known as a ‘pizza guy’, but there's a lot more to him. He's also a computer guy, a banker guy, and a rocket scientist guy.
Here's his bio:
* Bachelor's degree in Mathematics.
* Master's degree in Computer Science.
* Mathematician for the Navy, where he worked on missile ballistics
(making him a rocket scientist).
* Computer systems analyst for Coca-Cola.
* VP of Corporate Data Systems and Services for Pillsbury (this is the
top of the ladder in the computer world, being in charge of information
systems for a major corporation).
All achieved before reaching the age of 35. Since he reached the top of the
information systems world, he changed careers!
* Business Manager. Took charge of Pillsbury's 400 Burger King
restaurants in the Philadelphia area, which were the company's poorest
performers in the country. Spent the first nine months learning the business
from the ground up, cooking hamburger and yes, cleaning toilets. After three
years he had turned them into the company's best performers.
* Godfather's Pizza CEO. Was asked by Pillsbury to take charge of
their Godfather's Pizza chain (which was on the verge of bankruptcy). He
made it profitable in 14 months.
* In 1988 he led a buyout of the Godfather's Pizza chain from
Pillsbury. He was now the owner of a restaurant chain. Again he reached the
top of the ladder of another industry.
* He was also chairman of the National Restaurant Association during
this time. This is a group that interacts with government on behalf of the
restaurant industry, and it gave him political experience from the
non-politician side.
Having reached the top of a second industry, he changed careers again!
* Adviser to the Federal Reserve System. Herman Cain went to work for
the Federal Reserve Banking System advising them on how monetary policy
changes would affect American businesses.
* Chairman of the Kansas City Federal Reserve Bank. He worked his way
up to the chairmanship of a regional Federal Reserve bank. This is only one
step below the chairmanship of the entire Federal Reserve System (the top
banking position in the country). This position allowed him to see how
monetary policy is made from the inside, and understand the political forces
that impact the monetary system.
After reaching the top of the banking industry, he changed careers for a
fourth time!
* Writer and public speaker. He then started to write and speak on
leadership. His books include Speak as a Leader, CEO of Self, Leadership is
Common Sense, and They Think You're Stupid.
* Radio Host. Around 2007-after a remarkable 40 year career-he started
hosting a radio show on WSB in Atlanta (the largest talk radio station in
the country).
He did all this starting from rock bottom (his father was a chauffeur and
his mother was a maid). When you add up his accomplishments in his
life-including reaching the top of three unrelated industries: information
systems, business management, and banking-Herman Cain may have the most
impressive resume of anyone that has run for the presidency in the last half
century.
He has also escaped from the Democratic plantation and is an inspiration for all America not just Americans of color.
Ok, all you “big hearted” libs, this is what our guy has done. What has yours done?
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