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San Juan Capistrano Fines Family for Reading Bible without Permit
Reason ^
| 09/22/2011
| tim Cavanaugh
Posted on 09/22/2011 7:30:55 AM PDT by SeekAndFind
The city of San Juan Capistrano, California is laying heavy fines on a local couple for hosting semi-regular bible readings in their home. From the Los Angeles CBS affiliate:
Homeowners Chuck and Stephanie Fromm, of San Juan Capistrano, were fined $300 earlier this month for holding what city officials called a regular gathering of more than three people.
That type of meeting would require a conditional use permit as defined by the city, according to Pacific Justice Institute (PJI), the couples legal representation.
The Fromms also reportedly face subsequent fines of $500 per meeting for any further religious gatherings in their home, according to PJI
After city officials rejected the Fromms appeal, PJI, which represents other Bible study participants, will appeal the decision to the California Superior Court in Orange County
Neighbors have written letters to the city in support of the Fromms, whom they said have not caused any disturbances with the meetings, according to PJI.
The city attorney says the meetings have attracted up to 50 people. He claims the meetings are held Sunday mornings and Thursday afternoons, which would mean gross revenue of $1,000 a week for a city where the utilities agencies alone run at a deficit more than a third the size of their total budget, and whose finances are being subject to lengthy and expensive audits.
Here is a handy timeline [pdf] of the citys campaign against the Fromms bible readings at chuckfromm.net.
Pacific Justice Institute president Brad Dacus notes the irony of the citys violation of the First Amendments guarantee of religious expression in a city that was founded as a mission by Junipero Serra and is best known for a quasi-religious legend about cliff swallows. In a city so rich with religious history and tradition, this is particularly egregious, Dacus says in a PJI statement. An informal gathering in a home cannot be treated with suspicion by the government, or worse than any other gathering of friends, just because it is religious. We cannot allow this to happen in America, and we will fight as long and as hard as it takes to restore this groups religious freedom.
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TOPICS: Culture/Society; Government; News/Current Events; US: California
KEYWORDS: biblereading; california; christianpersecution; persecution; uschrnpersecuton
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To: SeekAndFind
Either claim they’re Muslim or, have a BBQ then read the Bible during it.
2
posted on
09/22/2011 7:32:19 AM PDT
by
SkyDancer
(A critic is like a legless man who teaches running.)
To: SeekAndFind
Violation of Matthew 18:20 “that when two or three are gathered together in Jesus’ name”
3
posted on
09/22/2011 7:34:50 AM PDT
by
dblshot
(Insanity: electing the same people over and over and expecting different results.)
To: SeekAndFind
So, here’s a question. Say I want to invite maybe 10-12 people over every week to watch Monday Night Football. Would that require a city permit? It would be a regular meeting, and have more than three people. What would be the deal on that?
4
posted on
09/22/2011 7:35:33 AM PDT
by
chimera
To: SeekAndFind
Tell the town to change its name.
It is named after a saint.
Have everyone show up in burkhas for the next meeting.
They give them a grant to continue.
5
posted on
09/22/2011 7:37:17 AM PDT
by
exit82
(Democrats are the enemy of freedom. Sarah Palin is our Esther.)
To: SeekAndFind
The totalitarians responsible for this should be fined, thrown out of office, and forced to live in Cuba.
6
posted on
09/22/2011 7:38:19 AM PDT
by
Hacklehead
(Had enough?)
To: Hacklehead
What happened to freedom of assembly ?
To: SkyDancer
RE: Either claim theyre Muslim or, have a BBQ then read the Bible during it.
But that would be lying, and that would be against Biblical teachings...
To: SeekAndFind
The title of this post is just slightly misleading.
9
posted on
09/22/2011 7:43:15 AM PDT
by
guppas
(A prayer for Obama - Psalm 109:8 ~ "Let his days be few and brief; and let others step forward to r)
To: Eric in the Ozarks
RE: What happened to freedom of assembly ?
According to the version understood by the town of SJC, you can freely assemble as long as you don’t regularly exceed 3 people...
See? we can always rationalize the Bil of Rights to fit our own interpretation.
Where’s the ACLU when it is really needed? /sarc
To: guppas
RE: The title of this post is just slightly misleading.
OK, give us a less misleading title.
To: guppas
But it gets lots of views and will stir up a lot of emotions this way...
12
posted on
09/22/2011 7:46:49 AM PDT
by
FromTheSidelines
("everything that deceives, also enchants" - Plato)
To: chimera
Your question is answered in caption of the picture.
13
posted on
09/22/2011 7:48:28 AM PDT
by
Michael.SF.
(When you hear hooves, think horses, not zebras.)
To: Hacklehead
50 people is a lot. We have a church in our neighborhood which the Archdiocese sold to people from Boston. This was a church in a small Italian neighborhood which people walked to. Now the narrow streets are clogged with cars from out of town parking illegally (the fire engine couldn’t turn on the street on several occasions)and crying racism (they’re Haitian)when the neighbors complained.
14
posted on
09/22/2011 7:48:35 AM PDT
by
massgopguy
(I owe everything to George Bailey)
To: SeekAndFind
Used to be when I saw a headline like this one I figured there was more to the story. The last five years or so there usually isn't more to the story. We live in bizarro land. Granted 50 people showing up in a residential neighborhood several times a week may be inconvenient but there are better ways of handling this than fines and a public story that makes both sides look foolish.
To: SeekAndFind
This dead horse was already beaten beyond recognition a couple of days ago...
16
posted on
09/22/2011 7:49:35 AM PDT
by
WayneS
(Don't Blame Me, I voted for Kodos!)
To: SeekAndFind
Little brother (the city) trying to play Big brother. I don’t give a rip what anyone says, there should be no interference with how I use my property, as long as others are not harmed or otherwise negatively impacted by my actions.
Zoning laws and regulations such as this example are nothing more than overzealous bureaucrats extending an assumed authority over others, without real people standing up to them.
It’s time to take back the country, and our freedoms.
17
posted on
09/22/2011 7:57:01 AM PDT
by
PubliusMM
(RKBA; a matter of fact, not opinion. 01-20-2013: Change we can look forward to.)
To: SeekAndFind
He claims the meetings are held Sunday mornings and Thursday afternoons, which would mean gross revenue of $1,000 a week Gross revenue? Doesn't he mean "fines" of $1,000 per week? So SJC (as well as others) now see fines as a method of increasing city revenues.
18
posted on
09/22/2011 8:01:02 AM PDT
by
Michael.SF.
(When you hear hooves, think horses, not zebras.)
To: SeekAndFind
This is hideous and shameful, and as another poster suggested, probably a revenue-raising scheme by the government.
Our next door neighbor has a regular men's Friday morning Bible study at 7:00 a.m., before they all go to work. The cars are parked all the way from the main road up past our house and up the hill -- probably 45-50 people.
Nobody complains, nobody minds, and certainly the county hasn't come snooping around to bother them (or us).
I'm glad these folks have representation, and I hope they sue the city fathers until their eyeballs rattle.
19
posted on
09/22/2011 8:02:17 AM PDT
by
AnAmericanMother
(Ministrix of ye Chasse, TTGC Ladies' Auxiliary (recess appointment))
To: PubliusMM
Amen to that! I think that enough people are suffering hopium withdrawl symptoms and pissed off enough to set this country back on the right course.
20
posted on
09/22/2011 8:03:41 AM PDT
by
WMarshal
(Where is the next Sam Adams?)
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