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To: Rooivalk
Do not forget that the Chinese are TOTALLY dependent upon maritime shipping of the vital resources that make their society run. And they have NO navy to prevent disruptions of their vital sea lanes.

If China tries to mess with America we could totally shutdown the flow of African oil that they depend upon. What would China do then? And even if they attempt to bully Vietnam or India, like they are doing now,those smaller powers could shut China down in a hurry. Imagine if the tiny submarine fleet of Vietnam or India decided to plant mines off the harbors on the Chinese east coast. Even just three Chinese ports put out of action by the threat of mines would cripple China severely. Again what would China do but complain loudly? They have no minesweeping capability to speak of.

By the time the riots were raging in China because they could not feed their people and their cheap imports were piling up at the docks China would be on its knees.

And that is just for starters

Firstly, I didn't forget about China's need for overseas oil, just as I didn't forget about our need for overseas oil. Their Navy might not have to go toe to toe with us, but has offensive capabilities that might surprise us... better subs, anti-carrier missiles, EMP weapons as well as software/electronic warfare.

I do know that Russia has agreements to provide several hundred thousand barrels of oil daily and there is no ocean between them.

Secondly and this is more important, how are we going to "shut down" the oil flow from other Asian or Persian countries. Iran, Iraq, Singapore and other South China Seas areas of oil. China has some of the largest coal deposits on earth and guess what????? They don't have the EPA handcuffing them.

Their population of over 1 billion and standing army of over 2 million aren't going to be allowed to "protest" or "sue" the government over austerity measures. Imagine all the porch monkeys and parasites in this country if the monthly check didn't come and they were made to actually work for some cash.

Finally, why would India, Vietnam or Singapore side with us in a conflict? If one of them mined their ports, what do you think China's response would be? Talk? not likely and everybody is figuring it out.

Why would you think that China would ever fight an open war that allows us to overwhelm their numbers with our technology. Pour half a million Chinese at the border of North Korea, invade Taiwan or blockade it, threaten India or Vietnam by massing troops on their northern border. What are WE going to do? Send troops to fight and die in a ground war in Asia .......again? bwahahahahahaha nope. Never going to happen. Nuke them? yeah, right..... with the weak sisters we have running the show trying to figure out the decor for female quarters on subs, how to invite to homosexuals to the Marine Corps Ball and who gets to "lead"..... which mullah is going to be the main chaplain for the armed forces, while the bible is considered anathema....

We're not going to kick anybody's ass.

We may even "win" a war, but it will take a near death response while we lose hundreds of thousands of men. Our country has been screwed by the anti-capitalist, communist loving, warriors that were breast fed on the Communist Manifesto and the corruption of our leaders. Lost Faith..... no semper fidelis here.... just quislings, cowards and thieves in BOTH parties.

72 posted on 08/19/2011 11:21:21 PM PDT by Dick Vomer (democrats are like flies, whatever they don't eat, they sh#t on.)
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To: Dick Vomer
Firstly, I didn't forget about China's need for overseas oil, just as I didn't forget about our need for overseas oil. Their Navy might not have to go toe to toe with us, but has offensive capabilities that might surprise us... better subs, anti-carrier missiles, EMP weapons as well as software/electronic warfare.

Have they ever used any of that stuff, you know, in a WAR?

73 posted on 08/19/2011 11:27:50 PM PDT by Trailerpark Badass
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To: Dick Vomer
Let me take your post point by point:
Firstly, I didn't forget about China's need for overseas oil, just as I didn't forget about our need for overseas oil. Their Navy might not have to go toe to toe with us, but has offensive capabilities that might surprise us... better subs, anti-carrier missiles, EMP weapons as well as software/electronic warfare.

Someone has been selling you some bad information if you believe that China has better equipment than America. Regarding submarines, the Chinese do not have a submarine that even matches our older Los Angeles class. And we now are building the Virgina Class and have a few examples of the Seawolf class. These American subs are the best in the world. The Russians knew it and the Chinese know it now.

Regarding this so called "anti carrier missile" the Chinese claim to have I believe you are referring to their DF-21D. This missile has never been tested. The Russians tried to build an anti carrier missile, the SN-X-13 and couldn't make it work. There is no evidence that the Chinese will be any more successful

Do not forget a Nimitz class carrier can make 30 plus knots upon warning of a missile coming its way. A Chinese land based missile would have to travel a long way just to get to the LAST KNOWN location of the carrier. And the American carrier would be long gone by that time. Do not forget the Chinese missile does not have time to loiter looking for the carrier. It is a ballistic missile.

I could give other reasons but the best thing to tell you is don't believe the hype. Until China solves some very complex problems this missile of theirs will be just that...hype.

Let them test this missile of theirs before we start shaking in our boots
79 posted on 08/21/2011 2:56:16 PM PDT by Rooivalk
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To: Dick Vomer
Regarding your comments about oil: I do know that Russia has agreements to provide several hundred thousand barrels of oil daily and there is no ocean between them. Secondly and this is more important, how are we going to "shut down" the oil flow from other Asian or Persian countries. Iran, Iraq, Singapore and other South China Seas areas of oil. China has some of the largest coal deposits on earth and guess what????? They don't have the EPA handcuffing them.

This flow of Russian oil is a drop in the bucket regarding Chinese needs. And the Chinese needs grows daily as they try to keep up with the demands of their society

Chinese oil from Africa and other distant points must pass through several choke points. Any disruption of flow of oil to China would occur at these places in the world. As I mentioned before, suppose we placed seaborne mines to close these choke points to Chinese traffic. What would they be able to do? Other than protest loudly they would back down the same way Russia backed down in 1962.

In two weeks China would have to fold. The Chinese domestic situation would force them to back down

Regarding Chinese coal, I encourage them to burn all the coal they can. The Chinese smog is so bad that burning more coal would cause a Chinese health crisis. Look up the pollution in China if you are not sure about what I am speaking about.
80 posted on 08/21/2011 3:12:05 PM PDT by Rooivalk
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To: Dick Vomer
More response to your misunderstanding about China:

Their population of over 1 billion and standing army of over 2 million aren't going to be allowed to "protest" or "sue" the government over austerity measures. Imagine all the porch monkeys and parasites in this country if the monthly check didn't come and they were made to actually work for some cash.

Yes China's population is over 1 billion and that population is a worry for the Chinese government. Aside from the cities located along the coast of China, the interior where most of the population is located remains DIRT POOR!

China has always had a problem with feeding their people. The last famine was in 1961
(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Great_Chinese_Famine).
China could be on the brink of another great famine due to crop failure and weather conditions.What would China do then? The concept of this "Rising China" and " The Chinese Century" would be seen as a joke

China Drought Prompts U.N. to Issue Warning - NYTimes.com www.nytimes.com/2011/02/09/business/global/09food.html?pagewanted...

Look this up and understand that China is far from the super power you have been led to believe:

The 2010–2011 China drought was a drought that began in late 2010 and impacted eight provinces in the northern part of the People's Republic of China (PRC). It was the worst drought to hit the country in 60 years, and it affected most of wheat-producing regions in the PRC.

Finally, why would India, Vietnam or Singapore side with us in a conflict? If one of them mined their ports, what do you think China's response would be? Talk? not likely and everybody is figuring it out.

China tried fighting Vietnam not to long ago and got their behinds kicked. China and Vietnam have recently exchanged gun fire in the South China Sea. India does not regard China as a friend due to the Chinese military build up on their northern border. If you do not know these facts you need to research them and get current. Both India and Vietnam have requested deeper relations with America. China is very upset over these developments

As for the rest of your post I agree that in many cases America has been hollowed out by stupid people acting like the flea wishing for the dog to die.
But never underestimate this country. There are still plenty of people would believe in the American way and stand ready to answer the bell
82 posted on 08/21/2011 3:46:07 PM PDT by Rooivalk
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