Posted on 07/25/2011 8:28:15 AM PDT by Virginia Ridgerunner
Heh! Interesting.
I’ll have to mention that to one of the guys I work with. He keeps talking about getting bear spray when he goes hiking/camping, I’m trying to convince him to get a good sized pistol.
It’s an ongoing discussion here.
Maybe a pump action shotgun is better than a large caliber handgun, no?
It is well known that bears are attracted to bear spray spayed on objects.
This is like saying I left my gun on the ground and the bear just walked right over it and attacked anyway!
Dumb.
Bear spray, like fire arms, only works when used as directed.
If I had a gun in my hand and bear spray on my belt I would use the gun of course.
Most people aren’t trained and practiced enough to use a gun effectively against a charging bear.
Yikes.
Attach that to some attitude (a famous trait of Grizzlies noted as far back as the stellar outdoorsmen of the Lewis and Clark Expedition), and we’ve got problems.
“I’ve read numerous studies and detailed accounts “
Typical yuppie: No experience but they read a book on the subject so they think they know what they are talking about. Kind of like a man knowing what childbirth is like because he read books about it.
Pepper spray has been know to stop a few attacks but pepper spray is not a physical end to an attack. Bullets can be. I carry a 44 magnum in the woods, and even then a bear can attack so quickly that not a shot could be fired before he took my head off. Caution is warranted as a best prevention but so is a physical defense, not a pepper spray “deterrent”.
You’re talking to the wind trying to convince people of that.
Fact is, most people wouldn’t even stand their ground with a hot headed cow trying to run over them much less a grizzly trying to eat them.
The 45-70 and 444 Marlin are in the top 10 of the list. 458 Win. Mag #1, 375 H&H #2, 338 Win Mag. #3. 30-06 w/250 gr. rnd nose, #4, 45-70 #5.
In the hands of a competent guide, there is nothing more effective that a 375 H&H. A 350 gr. RN delivers 5800 foot pounds of energy out to 25 yards. No Brownie on Earth could stand up to a solid, well placed hit from one of these.
I would pick it over a 458 because it has less recoil and the shooter recovers much quicker for a followup shot. (I have had actual experience stopping a charge.)
I think I’d like a reliable autoloader, or a Streetsweeper with slugs.
As I understand it, a LARGE CALIBER hit to the vitals can bring a Grizzly down, but the best thing is to hit bone and take out a hip. That immobilizes her. A shot to the head might ricochet off and a shot to the hump will just piss her off.
This is all gleamed from the experience of others.
People who read scientific studies are yuppies?
Right, you don’t go for all that thar fool book lernin, theys just some dum scientist aftr all.
Now stupid insults aside.
The argument isn’t whether bear spray is better than a gun and a human trained to use it properly. That would be a dumb argument.
The argument also isn’t that you should throw caution to the wind because you have a can of bear spray.
My argument was that bear spray is shown to effectively stop bears aggressive behavior. NOT deter them, but stop the aggressive behavior.
You admitted the same in your post, so what’s your argument again?
hip = hip/shoulder
We tell then to remove the front sight first. (They look at us quite puzzled.)
We then reply: “That way, it won't hang up on your teeth.”
Deciding to use a Pistol for Bear Protection over a rifle is fool hearty. even the biggest 454 Casul can only kill a bear with a head shot. (Body shots have serious penetration issues) And ever try to hit a grapefruit sized object (Brain) coming at you at over 30 miles per hour, bouncing randomly all over the place?
The heavy caliber rifle is there to break down the front shoulder structure first, to immobilize the animal, followed by a head or neck shot. You are right, that it is not a job for the inexperienced or the ignorant!
i think i will stay out of the woods until I know hibernation has begun.
How to survive in Bear Country:
Rule 1 - Carry adequate firepower.
Rule 2 - When hiking, let someone else go first.
Rule 3 - When running for your life, make sure someone else runs slower . . .
That’s actually a good point.
GREAT movie.. Just ordered it from E-Bay!!
Many inexperienced shooters would aim for that obvious and easy target. All they would do is pass over the actual skull through all of that inert flesh.
A stopping head shot should be aimed at the mouth or lower jaw, since the brain stem and the brain cavity is much lower in the head of a Brown Bear.
The use of shotguns with slugs has been proven in an earlier USGS study to be completely ineffective on Brown Bear. They determined that Slugs cannot penetrate the head and the skull or the body of a Bear with lethal effect.
See post #58
Also, you do know that bears eat skunks, don’t you? A hungry bear is not deterred; a curious bear - maybe. But, experienced hunters and guides will NEVER depend upon an aerosol can of anything.
Rule #4: Always carry a pistol to slow the other hikers running with you, down!
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