Posted on 06/14/2011 3:57:29 AM PDT by gusopol3
Bottom line. This was a New Hampshire debate, but it has serious ramifications for Iowa as well. I have disparaged the idea that Romney is the frontrunner; I continue to think that given the polls no one is the frontrunner. But Romney behaved like a frontrunner tonight, one with confidence and sense of command and with the adroitness to step aside from two major issue challenges (Romneycare, his various views on abortion) he faces. Romney has wisely eschewed the Iowa caucuses this time, leaving as two major competitors there Pawlenty (from next door Minnesota and a genuine religious conservative) and Bachmann (not only from next door Minnesota but also born and raised in Iowa). Presumably they will both be competing not only in the Iowa precinct caucuses, but in the August 13 Iowa Republican straw poll in Ames. I think Bachmann emerged from this debate a more serious competitor and Pawlenty not a stronger one than he was before.
(Excerpt) Read more at washingtonexaminer.com ...
A third party is not the way to go. It is political suicide and will give Obama another term, as it did Clinton. The real way to go is to push for a constitutional convention and demand term limits for Congress. That would take some of the power away from the parties and people in Congress would not have to be constantly running for office and hustling money. George Washington warned us about political parties. He was right.
Yes...it is becoming self evident that a third party is the only way to go.
I think your right.
The third party, in the senate and house, only needs enough elected unified members to take the majority away from either established (D and R) party.
If you really think this is true, and it isn’t frustration at how we win an election but still lose when it comes to policy, what do you see as our next step?
I think the Tea Party has already taken the first step...a grass roots outpouring of indignation against the Washington DC national party...the Dems and GOP.
It will have to be a grass roots movement across the country. I am no organizer but there must be people out there who know how to do this. The second step is to have a national conversation about what the third step should be.
Perhaps it has already begun on the internet. Makes you see why the national Washington party hates and fears the net.
Assuming Romeny or Pawlenty is nominated...the kubuki continues...even if Obama is defeated the national party’s framework is falling into place. Romney/Pawlenty are not going to resind anything major. Hell, Mitt laid the framework for Obamacare in Taxachusetts.
It’s gotta be a third party. We should research how the Republicans began to displace the Whigs and Know-nothings in the 1850s. I think it can be done, but only as long as the internet remains free.
Even Reagan had his off nights in debates.
Third party = 4 more years of Obama.
Third party = 4 more years of Obama. It’s a fact!
“It’s gotta be a third party.”
In 2010, we elected more than 700 patriots under the Republican banner and took complete control of 26 states. You want to throw that away?
These 700 patriots are in the state houses throwing wrenches into Pharaoh obuma’s fascist machine right now. This is our Class AAA farm team. Take a look and see what the state legislatures are doing to set thousands of brushfires and overwhelm the criminal fascist syndicate occupying Washington.
These people are our future leaders and will lead the way to overthrow the Marxists infesting Washington.
I won’t throw that away for some pie-in-the-sky fantasy of taking back Washington with a third party.
If you want four more years of Obama, this is the sure-fired way to get it.
Let's assume you're right. Now, how do you go about getting a pure enough candidate and get that candidate elected and then be sure you're getting the purity you think you're getting?
First let's start with the media. I don't think a lot of people would agree with me, but major media has overplayed their hand when it comes to Republicans. Any action that the Republican party takes is quickly branded as being right wing craziness, even if it's blatantly liberal. What are they going to say when the Republican party actually does something conservative? (not that I'm holding my breath) They have already used all of their ammunition. People can only hear "arch conservative right wing nazi racist" blather so often before it's just more noise.
When it comes to a new party however, it's a blank slate, and major media will be the ones to brand the new party. They have mocked, ridiculed and branded the Tea Party movement. It hasn't really worked simply because it isn't a party per se and it has no defined national leadership. As they don't have any one they can point to and ridicule they have trouble really pounding Tea Party. A new political party however would not have that advantage over media.
Second let's consider the logistics of starting a new party. It would need to start with a convention and temporary leadership. Then you have to jump through hoops in each state to be considered as being included on the ballot. This would require a lot of resources to get off the ground, and all this time the media will be castigating the new party. Unless you know a group of fantastically wealthy people who enjoy tilting at windmills I don't know where those resources would come from.
These two problems that I bring up are only two of many reasons why I don't think that starting a new party makes a lot of sense when compared to fixing the republican party. In fact that is relatively easy.
Establishment RINOs do what they do because they know that people are going to vote for them because the Dems are "worse". There is a reason why traitors are more despised than known enemies. We need to purge this scum and there is only one way to do that. Let it be known that betrayal of the constitution and conservative values will lose the betrayer ALL Republican votes. Republicans have to steel themselves to losing rather than electing RINOs. I'm not suggesting that we only elect perfect candidates, as they don't exist, but we can at least elect those that understand the constitution and have principles that they will not betray.
The republican party can be taken back, and while it wouldn't be easy, it would be a lot easier than trying to start a new party.
We already have at least 40 so-called “third parties” and that hasn’t created heaven on earth, why do you think one more is going to do it?
Sheeeyit. I'd take Reagan or Lincoln in their present conditions over what's in The White House right now.
“I still prefer storming the ramparts of the repugnican/demonrat castle to building our own.
These guys have set in stone a bunch of rules to benefit each other - hence the one-party ruling class - creating a redoubt impenetrable to third parties.
We must capture one of the parties in the primaries to gain entrance. “
Bears repeating. We are winning. Don’t give up now.
How many people standing on that stage last night have betrayed what they claim to be their principles for political expediency? How many of them even have principles? How many of them hold the constitution to be the basis of their conservative principles? The majority of them shouldn’t be on that stage out of pure shame, if not because they are entirely unelectable. (given educated and principled Republican voters)
Bachmann wants to take a hatchet to the EPA's job killing regulations. She wants to repeal ObamaCare as, among other evils, it costs jobs. She wants to cut corporate taxes.
Paul says capital is staying overseas because of the tax benefits. He wants a stronger dollar and he attacked the Fed. Says market corrections are good, the longer gov't tries to prop things up the longer it extends the misery.
Newt called this the "Obama depression." He wants to eliminate the NLRB and cited their killing jobs in SC by blocking Boeing from opening the plant there.
Cain doesn't believe in "too big to fail." Multiple candidates who got to comment felt straightforward bankruptcy reorganization was the way to go for GM and Chrysler.
Pawlenty said meddling in the housing market caused that bubble. He is also for a national "right to work" law.
I hope that summary helps!
Thank you for taking the time to post.
Only saw the baiting of Mr.Cain over his comments about being uncomfortable with a Muslim in his administration.and the question of shariah law in our Courts I think Mr.Newt spoke a truth that helps Mr.Cain when Newt spoke of the car bomber wanna be a jihadi.who typical to their kind, admitted he LIED when he took a oath of allegiance to our Constitution and way of life. And in Mitts response claiming we have a Constitution and Shariah will never bee in our Courts—either Mitt R. is a Liar— or beguiled because our Courts have considered Shariah as Mr.Cain suggests.
You're absolutely right. We've made a lot of headway at the state level. Pushing the Republican party back to its small government roots isn't easy, but I think it's still easier and faster than building a third party. If each of us gets involved personally, we can have a large influence on the GOP. I'm seeing it on a local level. We have new committee members, more conservative candidates, and renewed energy. Voters are responding. Washington isn't the only game. There is a huge concentration of power and money there, and it's not surprising that it's hard to change entrenched ways. We can do it - it will just take more effort, money and probably time than we'd ideally like.
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