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To: Cheburashka
The "Goons" own squeaky words:

"On the occasion corresponding to this four years ago all thoughts were anxiously directed to an impending civil war. All dreaded it, all sought to avert it. While the inaugural address was being delivered from this place, devoted altogether to saving the Union without war, urgent agents were in the city seeking to destroy it without war—seeking to dissolve the Union and divide effects by negotiation. Both parties deprecated war, but one of them would make war rather than let the nation survive, and the other would accept war rather than let it perish, and the war came."

                  -- The Goon's Second Coronation speech as Caesar

You can't have it both ways, those "evil" maniacal agents were trying to avert war by negotiation. Therefore the Illinois Butcher™ wasn't trying to avert the war. Simple rhetorical logic.

187 posted on 12/08/2010 6:01:01 AM PST by central_va (I won't be reconstructed, and I do not give a damn.)
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To: central_va
The slavers’s idea of negotiation: “Give us everything we want, NOW! Or we'll start shooting.” Which they did, firing at American soldiers, stationed in an American fort, built with American funds, on American soil ceded to the Federal government under the U.S. Constitution by the State of South Carolina.

Compare with the negotiations carried out by the Empire of Japan with the U.S. in November-December 1941. And with as much good faith.

Strange, isn't it, how the enemies of the United States all seem to go insane, and in similar ways. It's almost as if God wills it. Well perhaps it's just hubris on their part.

And by the way, I regard your over-the-top invective against Lincoln as merely showing your conscious (or subconscious) knowledge of the weakness of your position.

190 posted on 12/08/2010 6:55:14 AM PST by Cheburashka (Democratic Underground - the Hogwarts of Stupid.)
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To: central_va; Cheburashka
central_va: "You can't have it both ways, those "evil" maniacal agents were trying to avert war by negotiation. Therefore the Illinois Butcher™ wasn't trying to avert the war. Simple rhetorical logic."

Since secession requires "mutual consent," meaning the approval of Congress, the Deep South could legally have sent emissaries to Congress to seek its approval and establish whatever terms appropriate.

But of course, they never wanted to secede legally.

What they wanted was the same as our Founding Fathers -- a Southern Revolution, to win their freedom and independence on the battlefield of honor.

Therefore, the Deep South sent its emissaries to negotiate not with Congress, which could deal with it, but with Lincoln's administration, which had no express Constitutional authority for it.

Or am I mistaken?
Did I miss that part in the Constitution which says the President can negotiate terms with rebels and insurrectionists?

246 posted on 12/09/2010 7:51:54 AM PST by BroJoeK (a little historical perspective....)
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