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To: Joe 6-pack
I'm not trying to attack, just raise debate. Would I have the first amendment right to come to your home, knock on the door, and scream slogans at you, then when you slam the door in my face, knock again and again to repeat the process over and over?

What about at your work? Or on the street? What if I did it on the street, but only spoke to each person once, but did so to everyone in a loud and offensive manner?

What if I stood on the sidewalk on a public street, outside a synagogue and held posters saying Jews should burn? What if I was with several people and we chanted so loud it could be heard over the music of the cantor inside?

Is there no point where the practical application of the first amendment collides with the thoericial ideal?

23 posted on 10/06/2010 1:24:19 PM PDT by SoCal Pubbie
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To: SoCal Pubbie
"I'm not trying to attack, just raise debate. Would I have the first amendment right to come to your home, knock on the door, and scream slogans at you, then when you slam the door in my face, knock again and again to repeat the process over and over?"

I would argue that, provided my property was not posted "no trespassing" (and even if it was under some circumstances) you would have the right to do that once...just like a door to door salesman, Jehovah’s Witness, somebody soliciting signatures for a petition, or somebody who was lost and asking for directions, etc. After you've been asked to leave once, you're trespassing. To my knowledge the Phelps crew has gone out of their way to secure the correct permits, and avoid trespassing on private property during their little shows.

"What about at your work?

Again, the private property matter comes into play. It's a trespassing issue, not a free speech issue.

Or on the street?

As long as you're not obstructing traffic or creating a disturbance, you have that right. Usually, the "creating a disturbance" charge is preempted by securing a permit, which, to my understanding, the Phelps' have done.

"What if I did it on the street, but only spoke to each person once, but did so to everyone in a loud and offensive manner?"

What if the people entering and exiting an abortion clinic said the protestors there were praying in a loud and offensive manner? Should we strike down their rights as well?

"Is there no point where the practical application of the first amendment collides with the thoericial ideal?"

Well, IMHO, it goes back to public and private virtue and freedom and liberty being coupled with personal responsibility. Certainly, we can always go back to rights being limited when they impose on the rights of others. FWIW, I would love to see the Phelps's hammered with slander and libel suits...to my knowledge they've not yet crossed that line. I would love to see the Phelps's hammered with trespassing, public nuisance, obstruction of traffic, littering violations and burnt out tail lights everywhere they went...to my knowledge, they've been very careful not to cross any of those lines. They have every right to stand along the roadside and express their feelings as do the people who are standing along the roadside in support of the fallen service members and their families. Put it this way...if the Phelps's were there in support of the families, holding signs, and crying and wailing in grief, would anybody question their right to do so? What if they were demonstrating against the radical muslims responsible for the soldier’s death? The fact that people object to them is based solely on their (admittedly repugnant) message, and their message alone…and to start saying that some messages are allowable, while others are not is treading on dangerous territory.

25 posted on 10/06/2010 2:20:55 PM PDT by Joe 6-pack (Que me amat, amet et canem meum)
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