Officer convicted in Calif. train station killing

Associated Press ^ | July 8, 2010 | GREG RISLING

[Free ThinkerNY]

LOS ANGELES (AP) -- A white former transit officer was convicted of involuntary manslaughter Thursday in the shooting death of an unarmed black man on an Oakland train platform in a 2009 encounter that set off days of rioting in the city.

The jury deliberated more than six hours over two days to convict Johannes Mehserle in the killing of 22-year-old Oscar Grant, who was shot to death as he lay face-down.

[NormsRevenge]

not sure exactly, a number of months at least, he was on bail but it took a few months for that to happen, I think,, he’s been remanded to custody for duration.

[NormsRevenge]

the question of the weapon use also is still possible or the judge could toss it.. he’s looking at 8 to 15 or something, would have to serve 85% on a weapon charge, only 50% on the manslaughter charge.

[Popman]

Shocking, you mean justice is not really blind !!!

/ sarcasm

I would bet good money if this was a black cop who screwed up and shot a white kid he would have gotten off with the lightest sentence possible or even acquitted

White people don't riot

[PanzerKardinal]

1st a little legal education.

California Penal Code Sec 187 defines murder as:

(a). Murder is the unlawful killing of a human being, or a
fetus, with malice aforethought.

California Penal Code Sec 188 states:

Such malice may be express or implied. It is express when
there is manifested a deliberate intention unlawfully to take away the life of a fellow creature. It is implied, when no considerable provocation appears, or when the circumstances attending the killing show an abandoned and malignant heart.

When it is shown that the killing resulted from the intentional doing of an act with express or implied malice as defined above, no other mental state need be shown to establish the mental state of malice aforethought. Neither an awareness of the obligation to act within the general body of laws regulating society nor acting despite such awareness is included within the definition of malice.

________

So in order to convict on 1st degree murder you must show that the killer had to have formed a malicious intent to kill the victim.

And unlike what most laymen think, malice is not just shown by killing someone. You must show that there had to be a volitional act.

No one, not the witnesses, not the investigators, not even the people with Grant could show that a violitional act occured on Mehserle’s part.

___________

Cal Penal Code Sec 189 states that:

All murder which is perpetrated by means of a destructive
device or explosive, a weapon of mass destruction, knowing use of ammunition designed primarily to penetrate metal or armor, poison, lying in wait, torture, or by any other kind of willful, deliberate, and premeditated killing, or which is committed in the perpetration of, or attempt to perpetrate, arson, rape, carjacking, robbery, burglary, mayhem, kidnapping, train wrecking, or any act punishable under Section 206, 286, 288, 288a, or 289, or any murder which is perpetrated by means of discharging a firearm from a motor vehicle, intentionally at another person outside of the vehicle with the intent to inflict death, is murder of the first degree. All other kinds of murders are of the second degree.

_______

None of these above conditions were met.

_______

Cal Penal Code 192(a) defines Voluntary Manslaughter as homicide commited when the defendant is provoked or during the “heat of passion.

Cal Penal Code 192(b) defines Involuntary Manslaughter as murder without malice and commited during a misdeamnor or a lawful but dangerous act.

_________

There was no provocation or “heat of passion” here so no Voluntary Manslaughter.

But there was a murder without malice while the defendant comitted a lawful but dangerous act ie. arresting a suspect.

And even then....I might have voted for acquital.

I know that most people’s notions of criminal law comes from television, but this is real life. The prosecution couldn’t charge 1st or 2nd degree murder because it wasn’t there. And if they did it would have been misconduct.

I know that perhaps nothing sort of a lynching would have satified you, but we are still a nations of laws and not of men.

[ArmstedFragg]

Sentencing’s Aug 6.

[Beaten Valve]

Trouble in Downton Oakland..

LIVE Feed:

http://abclocal.go.com/kgo/story?section=news/local/east_bay&id=7534679

[PanzerKardinal]

I bet that in a few months we’ll find out that the only reason the Alameda County DA’s upcharged to 1st and 2nd degree murder, or even indicted at all, were because of political pressures.

[ArmstedFragg]

Two, three, or four is the sentence, three, four, or ten is the use of a gun enhancement. While the sentences are specified, California law permits a lot of judicial discretion in manslaughter cases.

[Vendome]

I heard what the “maybe” rioters likely heard.

They feel they did not get justice. I don’t see it that way.

I didn’t follow the case but assumed a conviction of Involuntary Manslaughter, which what thought should be.

[Political Junkie Too]

It's not the first time in California. In 2002, Madera Office Marcie Noriega shot Everardo Torres through the heart with a .40 Glock that she thought was a Taser.

Also in 2002, two Oakland PD rookie cops accidentally shot and killed undercover fellow officer Willie Wilkins. The two rookie officers mistook Wilkins for a homeless person who was brawling with someone else in a dark alley in the early morning. When Wilkins reached for his badge, the officers fired their weapons. They were not charged.

-PJ

[Godwin1]

A tragic mistake by a frightened and perhaps poorly trained officer. But it would not have happened if the career thug “victim” had not violently resisted arrest.
Yesterday, in my Chicago, a violent repeat criminal disarmed a Chicago cop, killing him with his own gun. Had the cop won the struggle, the headline would have been “White cop kills unarmed Black man.” Perhaps the cop knew this, perhaps he held fire when he should have shot the violent repeat offender. He may be dead today because he did not want to deal with Jesse Jackson and the usual suspect race-hustling reverends. To say nothing of the cop-hating vermin of the Chicago Tribune.

[ArmstedFragg]

Looks like a “massive crowd” of about a hundred...

[ScottinSacto]

"That's the same type of argument that says only black people can criticize Barack Obama because only they really know what it's like to be a black person in America. In other words, it's not a valid argument at all."

I didn't saying you can't criticize, but maybe the opinions of some of the less informed here could be based in the realm of reality. I've seen "cold blooded" mentioned several times here and it is actually the exact opposite in this incident. And the other comment is how can you mistake a Taser for a gun, and until you have carried and used both in your job, maybe you should STFU. Because if you had, your opinion would be based on fact and experience, not watching TV. That's all I was saying.

[PanzerKardinal]

Just wondering how you got 8 to 15 years?

Cal Penal Code 193(b) states that:

Involuntary manslaughter is punishable by imprisonment in the state prison for two, three, or four years.

Cal Penal Code 12022(a)(1) states that:

a) (1) Except as provided in subdivisions (c) and (d), any
person who is armed with a firearm in the commission of a felony or attempted felony shall be punished by an additional and consecutive term of imprisonment in the state prison for one year, unless the arming is an element of that offense.

_______________

My math adds up to 5 years.

[justa-hairyape]

Usually takes a couple of hours to brew the stew and its starting to get a little ugly. Woman was run into by Police car that was backing up away from crowd.

Hundreds March In Oakland Following Mehserle Verdict

[starlifter]

I think the cop is responsible for his actions. Gun or taser, he is paid to know the difference and when to use which.

In the end, he shot the kid. I've no idea if it was cold blooded or not - only the cop knows. But he killed a restrained suspect who was prone.

[dennisw]

lol true

[steel_resolve]

Thats pretty cool

[ScottinSacto]

I agree with all you points. And that is why he is got convicted. And cold-blooded is usually attributed to those lying wait to kill, not those in the heat of battle. When all the civil lawsuits are over and BART pays out millions, I am betting it will be based on the training records and find a deficiency in the TASER training.

[McGavin999]

I haven’t been following this at all. All I know is that no matter what the verdict is in Oakland there is going to be a riot.