Posted on 04/22/2010 2:27:59 PM PDT by Cincinna
President Nicolas Sarkozy of France told his cabinet on Wednesday that he would put forward a bill in May to ban the wearing of the full veil in public places in France, despite a warning from senior legal authorities that the bill may be unconstitutional.
Mr. Sarkozy wants a bill that goes farther than initial proposals, including a ban on wearing the full veil — the niqab, which leaves only the eyes uncovered, and the burqa, which is almost unknown in France — from streets, markets and shops, according to his spokesman, Luc Chatel.
The full veil “hurts the dignity of women and is unacceptable in French society,” Mr. Chatel quoted Mr. Sarkozy as telling the cabinet. The idea of a ban is popular with the French and with his own political party, while Mr. Sarkozy’s own standing in the opinion polls has rarely been lower.
An earlier proposal from a panel of the National Assembly suggested a bill banning the full veil in public places belonging to the state, like schools and public buildings, and in areas where facial recognition is vital for security reasons: airports, banks and even public transport.
Mr. Sarkozy’s push for broader restrictions was seen as a challenge to the Council of State, France’s top administrative authority, which warned in March that “a general and absolute ban on the full veil as such can have no incontestable judicial basis” and that it could be thrown out by the courts.
(Excerpt) Read more at nytimes.com ...
Quick, somebody make this man CEO of Comedy Central... STAT!!! ;)
The headline immediately following:
“OBAMA SEVERS DIPLOMATIC RELATIONS WITH FRANCE”
/sarc (I think)
Stupid. What if it’s really cold out and people want to wear scarves?
Remember last year, in Cairo, Obama said he wanted to defend the rights of Muslim women to be veiled, or words to that effect.
Wonder what he thinks of this. Will we see French youth setting more cars on fire? There have been numerous reports of French youth rioting in recent years. Jean-Pierre and Jacques and Jean-Claude and Yves are disaffected youth, expressing their rage for unknown reasons.
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Sarko is getting started on his recovery. Going back to his original plans for advancing France, and boosting his falling poll numbers.
The election is not until 2012, but getting back to basics, the economy, high unemployment, and immigration issues are very important.
NB: the number of women in France actually wearing the full Burka is very small...under 100. It is the principle of the issue that matters.
People named “Jean-Pierre and Jacques and Jean-Claude and Yves” are not at all the problem.
The issue is, can a country or state decide their own laws or do they have to cave to foreign laws every time.
I think the disaffected youth in France are more likely to be named Abdullah, Muhammed, and Oamr... but I get your point:)
What would conservatives think of a proposed bill in the USA to outlaw the Amish dress or the "ultra-Orthodox" Jewish dress?
I am well aware that we are at war with islam. However, we are also at war with secularism. I don't understand the bizarro quasi-alliance between medieval pseudo-"theocracy" and ultra-futurist atheists, but neither do I understand how conservatives can switch from "chr*stian patriots" to Thomas Paine at the drop of a hat (other than "chr*stian patriots" are Protestant, and Protestantism not only demands very little but also ropes itself off into an area it labels "religion," leaving the rest of the field to other considerations).
Okay. Y'all can start kicking me now.
Hey, France has no First Amendment. This is one of the few silver linings of a radically secular society.
Sir, none of those dress modes COVER your face fully.
Would you allow a man whose religion dictates that he wear a mask all the the time in public. No one would.
No one is banning orthodox islami dress that covers your hair while leaving your face unmasked.
As a civil libertarian I don’t support this. They shouldn’t be allowed in government buildings/schools but if somebody on the street wants to wear one of these or dress up as a wizard, become a idiotic looking goth rocker, or if a fellow feels like putting on a pink dress and high heels they should be able to.
Thanks Cincinna, and thanks Sarkozy!
Would you allow a man whose religion dictates that he wear a mask all the the time in public. No one would.
No one is banning orthodox islami dress that covers your hair while leaving your face unmasked.
As I said, I am not pro-moslem. I am, however, a Theocrat who ultimately doesn't believe in the legitimacy of secular governments. And conservatives who constantly switch from attacking the ACLU to attacking islamic sharia (as well as liberals who go from calling for "separation of church and state" to defending islamic sharia) simply have given me a case of whiplash. None of this makes any sense.
The closest I can compare this situation to is the old days of professional wrestling, when the heels (the "bad guys") never seemed to fight each other, even though each one of them claimed to be "the greatest of all time" and therefore should have had some amount of rivalry.
Why else are "gays" silent about a "theocratic" legal system that would have them executed? It's gotta be "kayfabe."
Well, ZC, I’ll jump into that 1st Amendment punchbowl with you any time.
France does not have a 1st Amendment, and their concept is basically secularism rules... no religion anywhere.
When Sarko banned the Muslim head scarf, included in that legal bundle was the banning of “all ostentious displays of religion” in government agencies, like schools. No scarves, but no yarmulkas, and no crosses around the neck either. I am a believer in free expression of religion for all. Sounds familiar? It is in the Constitution.
I posted extensively onm FR on the dangers of such bans, and mentioned that the Dean of Columbia Law School is an Orthodox Jew who wears a yarmulka, the Head of many departments in NY hospitals the same. I am a Christian and I wear a cross every day.
I do understand and agree with bans on covering the face, as this presents an identity issue. A man can walk into a bank in a Burka and be unidentifiable.
Thank God for the First Amendment and for the US Constution.
While it permits Moslems to cover their hair, not their face, it protects your right and my right to freely exercise our religious beliefs.
Let the government intervene to take it away from one group, and next they will be coming for you.
I agree, DD. I am almost an absolutist when it comes to the 1st Amendment.
Covering one’s face so one is not identifiable poses a risk to society at large, and I agree with banning it. The OP with the man in a mask analogy got it right. Except, of course, if you are the Lone Ranger.
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