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Army Report: GIs Outgunned in Afghanistan
Politics Daily ^ | 04/2/10 | David Wood

Posted on 04/03/2010 1:03:04 PM PDT by neverdem

American troops are often outgunned by Afghan insurgents because they lack the precision weapons, deadly rounds, and training needed to kill the enemy in the long-distance firefights common in Afghanistan's rugged terrain, according to an internal Army study.

Unlike in Iraq, where most shooting took place at relatively short range in urban neighborhoods, U.S. troops in Afghanistan are more often attacked from high ground with light machine guns and mortars from well beyond 300 meters (327 yards, or just over three football field lengths). The average range for a small-arms firefight in Afghanistan is about 500 meters, according to the study.

Unless U.S. troops under attack call in artillery or air strikes and risk civilian casualties, the only way they can fight back is with long-distance precision shooting -- a capability currently in short supply among infantry units, according to a study done at the Army's School of Advanced Military Studies at Fort Leavenworth, Kan., by Maj. Thomas P. Ehrhart.

According to Ehrhart's paper, Army infantrymen do not regularly train and practice shooting at distances of more than 300 meters. The round fired from their M4 carbines and M16 rifles, the 5.56mm bullet, don't carry enough velocity at long distances to kill.

While the Army has moved recently to equip each infantry company of about 200 soldiers with nine designated marksmen to overcome this problem, they don't often carry weapons with sufficient killing power at distance, and there aren't enough of them, Ehrhart reports.

Army spokesmen had no immediate comment on Ehrhart's paper, which was released by SAMS last month and given wider circulation by defensetech.org and the Kit Up! blog on military.com.

Most infantrymen in Afghanistan carry the M4 carbine, a version of the standard M16 rifle, but with a shorter barrel. It was designed to allow soldiers to operate from cramped armored vehicles and in the city neighborhoods of Iraq. But the shorter barrel robs the weapon of the ability to shoot accurately at long distances, because the bullet doesn't acquire as much stabilizing spin when it is fired as it does in a longer barrel.

Soldiers commonly are taught in training to use "suppressive fire,'' in effect returning enemy attacks with sprays of gunfire, which are often ineffective in Afghanistan.

One reason is the ineffectiveness of the most commonly used round, designated the M855. Gen. David Petraeus, the top U.S. commander in the Middle East, was once accidentally shot in the chest with an M855 round from a light machine gun; rather than being killed, he walked out of the hospital several days later.

Ehrhart recalls seeing a soldier shot with a M855 round from a distance of 75 meters in training. Twenty minutes later he was "walking around smoking a cigarette.''

Such incidents may be flukes, but they do illustrate that the rounds can lack killing power. Most infantrymen are equipped to fire the M855 round from their M4 carbine, M16 rifle, or the SAW (Squad Automatic Weapon), a light machine gun. When a firefight erupts in Afghanistan, they are unable to fire back accurately at more than 200 or 300 meters, leaving it to soldiers with heavier weapons -- the M240 machine gun, 60-mm mortars or snipers equipped with M14 rifles.

"These [heavier] weapons represent 19 percent of the company's firepower,'' Ehrhart wrote, meaning that "81 percent of the company has little effect on the fight.

"This is unacceptable.''

One quick fix, he suggested, is to equip the designated marksmen within each company with a powerful weapon that can kill at long distances, the M110 sniper weapon, which is effective out to 800 meters.

These rifles are expensive -- about $8,000 apiece. But you could outfit every infantry squad in the Army with two M110 rifles for the price of one U.S. Air Force F-22 Raptor supersonic stealthy fighter, Ehrhart noted.

Ironically, American doughboys in World War I were better trained and equipped for Afghanistan-style firefights than today's GIs.

"The U.S. infantry weapon has devolved from the World War I rifle capable of conducting lethal fire out to 1,200 yards, to the current weapon that can hit a target out to 300 meters but probably will not kill it,'' Ehrhart wrote.

The School of Advanced Military Studies, where Ehrhart was a student last year, trains the Army's brightest young officers for senior leadership. His unclassified paper, written last year, does not reflect official Army positions. But the paper has rocketed around in military circles and has been read avidly in some units preparing to deploy to Afghanistan.

But even before his report began circulating widely, some Army units were acting on the hard-learned lessons from Afghanistan, where the Army has been fighting for almost nine years.

Several weeks ago I watched an infantry battalion of the 10th Mountain Division's 4th Brigade Combat Team working on live fire maneuvers in central Wyoming.

One key focus, according to Command Sgt. Maj. Doug Maddi, was to hone soldiers' skills in high-angle and long-distance shooting -- precisely the skills not widely required in regular Army training, according to Ehrhart.

Where normal Army marksmanship training is often conducted on level ground against pop-up targets, Maddi and the battalion commander, Lt. Col. Chris Ramsey, had their men shooting up towering ridgelines and down steep inclines, and at distances out to 600 meters.

The battalion's troops, wearing their full battle kit, also were firing live rounds while running, and while running with heavy packs, up and down the steep Wyoming ridges.

"We're here to replicate the environment of Afghanistan," said Ramsey, who brought his battalion to Wyoming from its home base at Fort Polk, La. "We don't get this kind of terrain at home."

Ramsey told me he had not read Ehrhart's paper before his battalion deployed to Wyoming for a month's training in early February. Polishing those skills was "intuitive," he said. But he said the paper now has been read across the battalion.

At a meeting with reporters this week, Army Secretary John McHugh was asked whether he was familiar with the Ehrhart report. McHugh said he was not, but after hearing a brief description, he said he would track down the paper and read it.


TOPICS: Foreign Affairs; Front Page News; Politics/Elections; War on Terror
KEYWORDS: afghanistan; banglist; bhodod; ehrhart; ehrhartreport; guns; oef; oefsurge
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Only this long to figure out that the 5.56 mm M4 carbine & M16 rifle aint cutting it? You can take some satisfaction that the 7.62x39 mm rounds used in the AKs that jihadis carry are not full power rounds either, unlike the NATO 7.62x52 mm rounds fired in the M14 rifle and the M240 Medium Machine Gun. Does anyone have idea about how many M14s are still in the U.S. inventory?

M240 Medium Machine Gun




1 posted on 04/03/2010 1:03:05 PM PDT by neverdem
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To: neverdem

awgeez


2 posted on 04/03/2010 1:04:41 PM PDT by Perdogg (Nancy Pelosi did more damage to America on 03/21 than Al Qaeda did on 09/11)
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To: neverdem

The only M-14s still in the Army inventory are probably those in museums and with units like the Old Guard which uses them for ceremonial purposes. Most of the M-14s were probably destroyed after they were fully replaced by the M-16. Most likely new production line would need to be created to begin manufacturing them again..


3 posted on 04/03/2010 1:12:02 PM PDT by GreyFriar (Spearhead - 3rd Armored Division 75-78 & 83-87)
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To: neverdem

I’m trying to imagine the accuracy of an AK-47 at 500+ meters...do the bad guys ever hit anything?

FWIW, I suspect the ranges also depend on what part of Afghanistan you are in, but 500+ meters is a LONNGGG way for an Afghan to try shooting.


4 posted on 04/03/2010 1:12:24 PM PDT by Mr Rogers
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To: neverdem

Send some more M-1A’s over. Heavier to carry, but good out to longer ranges.


5 posted on 04/03/2010 1:12:56 PM PDT by oneolcop (Lead, Follow or Get the Hell Out of the Way!)
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To: neverdem

But I’d rather be hit with the 7.62x39 than the 5.56 pea-shooter. Are there any Western bloc assault rifles (i.e. not machine guns) that fire the 7.26x52, besides the M14?

I remember one of the Delta operatives in Black Hawk Down in Somalia preferred the M14. We never learned the lesson from Mogadishu that 5.56 is not an acceptable round for military purposes.


6 posted on 04/03/2010 1:13:09 PM PDT by Thane_Banquo (Mitt Romney: He's from Harvard, and he's here to help.)
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To: neverdem

Oops, meant I’d rather be hit with the 5.56 than the 7.26x39.


7 posted on 04/03/2010 1:13:42 PM PDT by Thane_Banquo (Mitt Romney: He's from Harvard, and he's here to help.)
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To: neverdem

Naturally, seeing as how our defense budget is dwarfed by that of the insurgents.


8 posted on 04/03/2010 1:15:02 PM PDT by Wolfie
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To: neverdem
If our guys need M110s, then give them to them. $8,000 /weapon? Chickenfeed compared to Ø's spending.


9 posted on 04/03/2010 1:15:34 PM PDT by 50cal Smokepole (Effective gun control involves effective recoil management)
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To: GreyFriar

Actually, Springfield Arms still makes semi-auto versions, the M-1A. I just bought one for my son. And there are still M-14’s in inventory in some obscure warehouse somewhere, I’m sure.


10 posted on 04/03/2010 1:16:13 PM PDT by oneolcop (Lead, Follow or Get the Hell Out of the Way!)
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To: neverdem

It’s Bushs’ fault!!!!!!!!!!


11 posted on 04/03/2010 1:16:46 PM PDT by Paul46360
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To: neverdem

M16/M4 in those valleys are useless.

McNamara still killing American troops as he roasts in hell.


12 posted on 04/03/2010 1:19:00 PM PDT by Frantzie (McCain=Obama's friend. McCain called AMERICANS against amnesty - "racists")
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To: neverdem
It'd be reasonable to expect it to take 3 or 4 years before we realize that the enemy is hitting us before we're hitting them, but 8+ years does seem a bit excessive.

13 posted on 04/03/2010 1:19:21 PM PDT by Riodacat (Never attribute to malice what can be adequately explained by stupidity.)
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To: 50cal Smokepole

Better yet if the m110’s are built here. We can stimulate the economy and the enemy at the same time.


14 posted on 04/03/2010 1:21:01 PM PDT by Riodacat (Never attribute to malice what can be adequately explained by stupidity.)
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To: Perdogg
$8000 for a sniper rifle? Hell, I could take any off the shelf Remington 700 tactical and put a Leupold on in and be out the door for 2 grand and shoot the wings off a bumblebee at 500 yards.
15 posted on 04/03/2010 1:21:32 PM PDT by bitterohiogunclinger (America held hostage - day 393)
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To: Paul46360
Damn Mouse Guns, get a call into Ronnie Barrett Fast/
16 posted on 04/03/2010 1:22:54 PM PDT by BooBoo1000 (Vote for Pedro)
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To: Thane_Banquo

The HK-417 is 7.62mm but the Bundeswehr doesn’t use it, they use the 5.56mm


17 posted on 04/03/2010 1:23:15 PM PDT by Perdogg (Nancy Pelosi did more damage to America on 03/21 than Al Qaeda did on 09/11)
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To: Thane_Banquo

You’d rather be hit with a 7.62? Me, I’d rather be shooting a 7.62 than a 5.56 at you, providing you were the enemy. Especially since the famous tumbling M-16 round isn’t made any more, or I don’t think it is.


18 posted on 04/03/2010 1:24:31 PM PDT by GreyFriar (Spearhead - 3rd Armored Division 75-78 & 83-87)
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To: Thane_Banquo

The Israelis use the 5.56mm the Chinese use the 5.6mm and the Russians use the 5.45mm


19 posted on 04/03/2010 1:24:40 PM PDT by Perdogg (Nancy Pelosi did more damage to America on 03/21 than Al Qaeda did on 09/11)
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To: neverdem
There is plenty of M-1A's.

I have one and they are the same as the M-14 to the point that my M-1A came from Springfield with a military M-14 tear down manual.

20 posted on 04/03/2010 1:26:16 PM PDT by EGPWS (Trust in God, question everyone else)
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