Posted on 01/21/2010 10:54:34 PM PST by ErnstStavroBlofeld
The U.S. Navy accidentally posted their classified estimate on the size and composition of the Chinese Navy. This data was quickly taken down, but not before it was copied and posted worldwide. The strength of the Chinese fleet was listed as;
Submarines- 62 (53 diesel Attack Submarines, six nuclear Attack Submarines, three nuclear Ballistic Missile Submarines). The U.S. has 72 submarines, all nuclear (53 attack and 18 ballistic missile.)
Destroyers-26. The U.S. has 52.
Frigates-48. The U.S. has 32, including two of the new LCS vessels.
Amphibious Ships 58. The U.S. has 30, all much larger and equipped with flight decks and helicopters, plus landing craft.
Coastal Patrol (Missile)- at least 80. The U.S. had a few of these, but got rid of them. China uses these for coastal patrol and defense, a concept they inherited from the Russians.
In addition, the U.S. has eleven aircraft carriers (ten of them nuclear powered) and 22 cruisers.
Most of the Chinese ships are older (in design, if not in the age of the vessels) than their American counterparts. China is building new classes of ships, with more modern equipment and weapons. Their new destroyers have better anti-aircraft weapons, although nothing to match the American Aegis system, much less the 20 U.S. Aegis ships with anti-missile capability. China is trying to develop classes of nuclear submarines that come close to the capabilities of their American counterparts. China is also vastly outmatched in naval aviation, with nothing comparable to the hundreds of American maritime patrol (P-3) aircraft. But China is building aircraft carriers, and upgrading its naval aviation. They are also innovating in some areas, like the development of a ballistic missile that can hit a moving ship (preferably an American carrier.)
(Excerpt) Read more at strategypage.com ...
The US has the Coast Guard to do this job in peace or in time of war.
The US havy could fire a standard missile salvo from just its pacific-deployed fleet, and overwhelm every SAM the Chinese navy could put up to stop them, and hit every Chinese surface vessel 3-4 times over with the survivors that get through.
As for submarine warfare, the US subs can hear the Chinese ones scores of miles away and are completely invisible themselves. It is a knife fight against a blind cripple.
China's navy is outclassed by Japan's and equaled by India's. It is not remotely in the same weight class as the US. Only Russia is in our weight class, and even on paper theirs is still inferior on every important metric. In real world readiness, training, software and sensor systems, even they are not in our league, and by a wide margin.
Thank you for the info. Good to hear this analysis.
A simple comparison by class title (frigate, cruiser, attack boat etc..) is nearly useless even comparing Destroyers in the US Navy is almost pointless
Example Compare
Spurance Class - used till 2005
Arleigh Burke - Main DD in n service
Just to make things more confusing the Ticonderoga class cruiser was originally going to be a DD, as it shares the basic hull as the Spurance
Compare US CVNs to ANY Carrier by any other nation.
China Fleet Ping for Jeff Head - some rehab reading.
First rule of war: Never underestimate your enemy.
It isnt as if Chinese subs pop up in middle of U.S. Navy exercises...
How do you separate the men from the boys in the Chinese navy?
With a crowbar.
If all 29 of the Seawolf class subs would of been built, the US would of have total naval domination for a many, many years.
The total single salvo "throw" of SAMs from the Chinese surface navy is 336 missiles, and 192 of those come from a handful of their best Russian-built destroyers. Which are approximately equal to the US "Kidd" class of mid 1980s vintage. The next 57 Chinese surface combatants combined have only 144 SAMs throw, some carrying none, some a single 6 or 8 tube launcher. The whole fleet has 358 SSMs full salvo to throw.
22 US CAGs and 55 US DDGs have between them a SAM throw of 7634 missiles, carrying 90 or 122 per ship. A surface action group with 4 combatants could shoot a full Chinese navy salvo out of the sky with one SAM salvo from 4 Aegis air defense ships.
These are flexible launchers that can carry Standard II or III (primary mission air defense, but can also engage smaller sea-surface targets), or harpoon to shoot at full sized ships with full sized warheads, or tomahawk to shoot at land targets.
A quarter of the US surface navy firing a full salvo could put 1900 missiles inbound at a Chinese fleet that can only intercept less than 20% of them, even if they can get every outgoing missile to hit, which they won't with their software and sensor systems (especially the older SAMs on everything but the top 4 DDGs).
That's if the US SSNs or up to 800 carrier aircraft don't take out those 4 DDGs first. If they do, the rest of the Chinese navy are nothing but targets; there is no SAM umbrella to overload and burn through in the first place, once those 4 ships are out of action.
Thus my comment, "not in our weight class". Leave aside the technical edge; they just can't shoot enough missiles to burn through our SAM umbrella, while we can hopelessly overload theirs without breaking a sweat.
I agree.
The US Navy no longer has a conventional carrier, all of them are nuclear. Also, we are in the process or building the USS FORD.
I recall a discussion with an analyst who teaches at the Navy war college about the threat from small platform "swarm" tactics in a Taiwan strait confrontation, in which the US came to Taiwan's aid, against China. His response was succint. Full quote - "Liquid environments. Sensor technology. No problem". (With big grin...)
Yes, the US Navy can throw up a fantastic amount of missiles in the air at once that no other Navy can touch. An Aegis.
Box launchers are also quite valid, even if used primarily for sea-skimmers like Harpoon and Exocet.
In the end your analysis is fairly good that total weight of arms on target (both offensive and defensive) is very much in the USNs favor
Play Harpoon some time and the difference between the USN and every one else is quickly beaten in to you !
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