Posted on 01/13/2010 2:05:52 PM PST by Red in Blue PA
US EVANGELICAL preacher Pat Robertson has blamed Haitians directly for the devastating earthquake, saying that the country "swore a pact to the devil'' at its creation. "Something happened a long time ago in Haiti, and people might not want to talk about it,'' Robertson said on his Christian Broadcasting Network show The 700 Club.
The 80-year-old former presidential candidate said Haitians were originally "under the heel of the French".
"You know, Napoleon the third, or whatever.
"And they got together and swore a pact to the devil.
"They said, we will serve you if you will get us free from the French. True story.
(Excerpt) Read more at heraldsun.com.au ...
You raise some interesting questions. I am not Catholic or any other denomination but I am a Christian. I believe true believers can be found in various denominations but the heart of what they believe makes them a Christian not who they affiliate themselves with.
I am thankful to have a church home that supports Biblical teaching. I am sorry that you have not had that blessing. Regardless of where you are now, I encourage you to read the Bible for yourself. God will show you the truth if you desire to be shown.
By the way, I accept that the story of Haiti’s beginning may be just a legend.
(That's six)
He also excused abortions in China when he wanted to open up a TV network over there. “Maybe it’s necessary for them.”
He’s already senile and the left knows it that’s why they keep quoting him.
Pat is scum. Pure scum.
Did not know about the Diamonds. Thanks :)
Haiti: Victim of Clinton's Old Black Magic
The Catholic view of Satan has it that all who chose to do evil are his spiritual allies. The idea though that anyone, let alone an entire country, can be cursed is much disputed.
I know a bit about voodoo and Haitian culture from having worked there for months at a time 20 years ago after wuttle Doc and his “light skinned and non Negro speaking” beauty of a wife fled
Haiti has suffered enough without any more of God’s punishment now for 200 years since the slave rebellion.
But I will go out on a limb here and say that I do think that the universal acceptance of voodoo there is bad for the culture and no it is not innocuous like the “all cultures and religions are relative” crowd will say with platitudes
it has helped foster a warped version of Catholicism and creates a superstitious and largely ingnorant and easily manipulated and agitated mass populace...with some exceptions obviously but in a nation where over half are illiterate the effect is very negative and effective for those who use it to exploit
none of which has to do with this awful catastrophe which can only be blamed on geography
but the nation’s vulnerability can in part be blamed on the shackle of voodoo superstition and what that fosters
just my two cents on it
I think the aftermath of the slave revolt and how that was handled effectively massacring or exiling the very folks who could have rebuilt a free nation was what doomed Haiti..
even today the friction tween the tiny Mulatto bourgeoisie and the dark skinned poorer as a rule masses is palpable
now the place is so overpopulated and decimated...it could do some tourism but I still don't see that supporting 10 million folks in a harsh tropical place with little arable land and denuded mountains..about the size of Maryland
i love Haiti in a way...a unique place but so tragic...whew...so pitiful how these folks are suffering
For Haitian and even Louisiana slaves to be, to live in Senegal or elsewhere in Africa was far better. Even with low life expectancy, it is far better to live in freedom, in one’s one culture, and among one’s friends and relations.
Wasn’t talking about freedom...talking about life expectancies. Freedom is what freedom is, in those days it was hardly as absolute as we view it today.
I would say it is debatable as to what you propose and I can assure you from having been there extensively that blacks in Haiti never felt far from their culture....and that has been a part of the problem there.
It is as African as Africa in some ways..more so even than some parts say...Southern Africa.
The most unfortunate thing for Haitians is that unlike American blacks or even to a some degree blacks anywhere in the New World, they are not better off today because their ancestors were brought here in the slave trade.
Haiti is about like average west Africa or Congo regions...maybe even worse than some. I have been there too and can make that comparison from personal experience.
There is simply no way to rebuild Haiti into even something resembling say Martinique without a huge depopulation of the natives and importing a ton of new folks to jumpstart it along with much needed cash that isn’t stolen.
We are talking about inanimate objects, not “demons”. Inanimate objects are incapable of being evil, as recognized by sensible people who do not subscribe to the notions held by voo-doo cultists, gun-control organizations, and similar hotbeds of irrationality.
We are talking about inanimate objects, not “demons”. Inanimate objects are incapable of being evil, as recognized by sensible people who do not subscribe to the notions held by voo-doo cultists, gun-control organizations, and similar hotbeds of irrationality.
The problem here is that many people dismiss the idea of evil spirits/demons/evil angels -- as figments of people's imaginations. But, the Bible makes clear that they are real and that they interact with our world and are the "real battle" that we face in this world...
Ephesians Chapter 6 11 Put on the whole armor of God, that you may be able to stand against the wiles of the devil. 12 For we do not wrestle against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this age, against spiritual hosts of wickedness in the heavenly places. 13 Therefore take up the whole armor of God, that you may be able to withstand in the evil day, and having done all, to stand.
In Daniel, for one example, we see where an evil spirit was attempting to block the revelation given to Daniel in answer to his prayer. The angel who was sent to speak to Daniel and given him the revelation and understanding was blocked for days before being able to proceed on to Daniel.
Daniel Chapter 9 20 Now while I was speaking, praying, and confessing my sin and the sin of my people Israel, and presenting my supplication before the Lord my God for the holy mountain of my God, 21 yes, while I was speaking in prayer, the man Gabriel, whom I had seen in the vision at the beginning, being caused to fly swiftly, reached me about the time of the evening offering. 22 And he informed me, and talked with me, and said, "O Daniel, I have now come forth to give you skill to understand.
Daniel Chapter 10 11 And he said to me, "O Daniel, man greatly beloved, understand the words that I speak to you, and stand upright, for I have now been sent to you." While he was speaking this word to me, I stood trembling. 12 Then he said to me, "Do not fear, Daniel, for from the first day that you set your heart to understand, and to humble yourself before your God, your words were heard; and I have come because of your words. 13 But the prince of the kingdom of Persia withstood me twenty-one days; and behold, Michael, one of the chief princes, came to help me, for I had been left alone there with the kings of Persia. 14 Now I have come to make you understand what will happen to your people in the latter days, for the vision refers to many days yet to come."
And evil spirits are territorial and do come along with inanimate objects and stay at certain locations.
One such example of an inanimate object and evil spirits - Ouija Boards are inanimate objects, too, but they are accompanied by demons and evil spirits...
Although ouija boards are viewed by some to be a simple toy, there are people who believe they can be harmful, including Edgar Cayce, who called them "dangerous."
Some practitioners claim to have had bad experiences related to the use of talking boards by being haunted by "demons," seeing apparitions of spirits, and hearing voices after using them. A few paranormal researchers, such as John Zaffis, claim that the majority of the worst cases of so-called demon harassment and possession are caused by the use of Ouija boards. The American demonologists Ed and Lorraine Warren stated that "Ouija boards are just as dangerous as drugs."[25] They further state that "séances and Ouija boards and other occult paraphernalia are dangerous because 'evil spirits' often disguise themselves as your loved ones—and take over your life."
Many Christians hold the belief that using a Ouija board allows communication with demons, which they say is Biblically forbidden as a form of divination. Some people who claim to have been oppressed by evil spirits after using a board say that they could only get rid of these problems after Christian deliverance. Many Christians believe that no dead person's soul can be summoned, and that the only summoned spirits are demons who are trying to harm humans.
As early as 1924, Harry Houdini wrote that five people from Carrito, California were driven insane by using a board. That same year, Dr. Carl Wickland in his book stated that "the serious problem of alienation and mental derangement attending ignorant psychic experiments was first brought to my attention by cases of several persons whose seemingly harmless experiences with automatic writing and the Ouija board resulted in such wild insanity that commitment to asylums was necessitated."
In 1944, occultist Manly P. Hall, the founder of the Philosophical Research Society and an early authority on the occult in the 20th century, stated in Horizon magazine that, "during the last 20-25 years I have had considerable personal experience with persons who have complicated their lives through dabbling with the Ouija board. Out of every hundred such cases, at least 95 are worse off for the experience." He went on to say that, "I know of broken homes, estranged families, and even suicides that can be traced directly to this source."
The former medical director of the State Insane Asylum of New Jersey, Dr. Curry, stated that the Ouija board was a "dangerous factor" in unbalancing the mind and believed that if their popularity persisted insane asylums would be filled with people who used them.
Decades later, in 1965, parapsychologist Martin Ebon in his book Satan Trap: Dangers of the Occult, states that "it all may start harmlessly enough, perhaps with a Ouija board," which will, "bring startling information... establishing credibility or identifying itself as someone who is dead. It is common that people... as having been 'chosen' for a special task." He continues, "Quite often the Ouija turns vulgar, abusive or threatening. It grows demanding and hostile, and sitters may find themselves using the board compulsively, as if 'possessed' by a spirit, or hearing voices that control or command them."
But, Ouija Boards are not the sole province of evil spirits and demons in regards to inanimate objects. Anything that is clearly known to be for the practice of contacting or interacting with evil spirits and/or demons -- I would have absolutely nothing to do with, anywhere near me.
There's no good end to inviting evil spirits and demons to reside in your own house by the bringing in of objects which are known to be connected and associated with such evil spirits.
Now, the general population may not be as aware of this as Christians..., but there does seem to be some foolish Chritians out there who may think that it's okay to bring in evil spirits into their house, which can accompany such inanimate objects.
Christians don't need to be foolish and naive in regards to the evil spirits and demons that the Bible clearly indicate are out and among us in this world.
I don’t know if you’ve had any direct experience with Ouija Boards, but I thought I would ping you to the post, above, about this and evil spirits and inanimate objects being associated with evil spirits.
Apparently there are some who don’t think — either — that evil spirits exist, or perhaps they think they do, but don’t associate themselves with locations and/or inanimate objects and/or don’t interact with our realm — even though the Bible does make it clear to us that they are there and that they do interact in our own realm of existence.
One time, when I was young and in high school, there were some neighbors who just got a Ouija Board and my friend invited me over to play around with it. There were three of us on it and it was darned spooky — spooky enough, in its actions of moving by itself, although with our hands slightly on it (as the instructions were, that were given). We kept looking at each other and accusing each other of “moving it around” until we finally figured out, after examining what was happening after a while — that none of us were doing that. Now, that’s a pretty subjective experience, but from many other peoples’ experiences, nothing good ever comes out of this and it’s definitely something for all Christians to stay away from (not to say anything about “anyone” staying away from it).
After that experience, we all just stayed away from that Ouija Board and never used it again. I didn’t have it in my house; it was in a neighbor’s house, but if it were mine, I would have thrown it away, right on the spot.
INDEED.
I hope you repented and prayed off any forces and influences from that experience.
Playing around with such . . .
idly scanning the horoscopes in the newspaper . . .
all such give a ‘legal’ door in the spiritual realm through which the enemy has a ‘legal right’ to afflict the particpants who have violated God’s law on such matters.
Not according to my understanding of Scripture.
The opposite is true, too. Remember the bones of the prophet that enlivened the corpse thrown in on top of them?
Certainly God had many objects in the Old Testament pulverized and scattered to the four winds.
Many occult objects—OBJECTS—were forbidden to be touched by believers under serious penalty.
I certainly don’t pretend to know the mechanism.
Perhaps the violation of God’s orders allows demonic forces to ride along with the object somehow and affect things. Perhaps there’s some demonic force that saturates the object.
I don’t think THAT issue matters that much. The OBJECT has with it demonic influence and potency of some sort. That much is fact. I’ve observed it as have thousands of people who’ve been invovled in delverance ministry or who have lived overseas in cultures where demonic cultures were quite saturated with such forces.
There is a BIBLICAL REASON to cleanse one’s house of all idols of any sort—particularly object created as idols.
One house church I was a part of in San Diego was led by a formerly Methodist MD and his wife. They had designed their house overlooking San Diego from a La Mesa hilltop in the Japanese style. He had been an MD in the Navy and they had brought back lots of artifacts from Japan, including Buddhas etc.
When they were led into a fuller walk with Holy Spirit, HE led them to experts in such matters—some in Japan—who notified them that before such idols were shipped to foreign countries, priests
PRAYED DEMONS INTO THE OBJECTS.
I have no trouble believing that, at all.
Many problems in families or in a room have disappeared when such objects have been removed and smashed.
“But for Robertson to tie any one particular event into anything happening currently is such a stretch.” ——————— I’m not so sure. The practice in Haiti was handed down to each generation. Haiti’s cultural traditions also have their part to play in making the standard of living there lower than anywhere in the Caribbean and most of Sub-Saharan Africa. The prevailing belief in voodoo continues to mean that many Haitians reject modern medicine in favour of more traditional practices. A visit to the village witch doctor is for many Haitian parents the first port of call when their child falls ill. Without access to clean water and without treatment for basic illnesses the child mortality rate in Haiti is one in five, with diarrhoea, malaria and TB the most common causes of death.
Ironically for the only country ever to have had a successful slave revolt, child enslavement is also a culturally accepted practice in Haiti.
Background: HAITI - An international crime scene, not a country.
Haiti: Rape, murder and voodoo on the Island of the Damned
By Andrew Malone
“ordered the death of all black dogs in the country after a political enemy was rumoured to have transformed into one.”
How anyone could confuse these charming folkways with Devil worship is beyond me.
Posted by Ghost of a flea at January 14, 2010
I think that sometimes Pat is intemperate, brash and hasty when he says things.
However, . . . on the whole . . . depending on how one ascribes blame . . . in spiritual matters . . .
SPIRITUAL CHOICES HAVE CONSEQUENCES.
EITHER ETERNALLY DEVASTATING CONSEQUENCES
OR
ETERNALLY LIFE GIVING CONSEQUENCES.
THERE ARE NO MIDDLE GROUNDS.
ALL MIDDLE GROUNDS ARE AN ILLUSION.
ALL OUR CHOICES ALL THE TIME ARE EITHER CONTRIBUTING A LITTLE OR A LOT TOWARD OUR ETERNAL ‘DEATH’ OR OUR
ETERNAL LIFE.
THERE ARE NO OTHER OPTIONS.
This multiverse has not been constructed
with a neutrality option.
At least 50% of the Hatian populace and major portions of the top government officials for many decades have engaged in
abject voodoo witchcraft enlisting satan’s favor.
That has consequences.
One can white wash it up one side and down the other.
The fact of the matter at the end of the day is that
that
has consequences.
There are many folks—even some “Christians” who love to pretend that there is no satan. That satan is no more real than santa claus.
They are wrong.
This END TIMES era is going to see—increasingly—as we have already started to see—the forces of darkness flood the land with a vengeance because they know their time is limited.
God is going to also intensify HIS overt hand in the affairs of man and world events.
This is just the warmup.
California is headed for some similar devastations not that far off.
When I heard of all the UN workers missing . . . I wondered . . . would God begin to show His hostility toward the globalists by . . . taking care of . . . such missions around the world. I don’t know that He will. But it would sure be interesting if He did.
Regardless . . . I don’t know how God apportions out responsibility and blame . . . I’m just glad He does it.
I do know that generally speaking . . . witchcraft carries severe consequences with it.
On that score, Pat is quite right.
People don’t seem to change much...it reminds of the Israelites stoning the prophets of old...they didn’t like what they heard or agreed with it...so here come the stones...
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