BURNIN' DOWN THE TENT!!!
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Posted on 01/08/2010 6:18:55 AM PST by MestaMachine
BURNIN' DOWN THE TENT!!!
Do we want action? Yes, we do!!!
Are we willing to take a giant step forward and create a central action site that allows us to see at a glance every single state’s candidates for national office, House and Senate, to separate the wheat from the chaff? That is our hope. We want to spend our money, our time, and our votes wisely. Our time is JUST as valuable as the money we spend.
The goal is to take back and take over the GOP, or move it out of the way, and elect conservatives to every office we can affect whether the RNC likes it or not.
To do this, we need a clearinghouse and a plan of action that encompasses all 50 states in ONE place. That place is Free Republic. THIS is where we nationalize the 2010 election cycle and choose where our money and our time is spent. The genius of Free Republic is that it already has the 50 state message boards. We don’t have to “google” our way through hundreds of candidates in individual states to find out who is who doing what. It’s already here, just not out in the public eye. This will change that.
I, and others, have repeatedly asked Freepers to present workable ideas with this goal in mind, and there have been many, but the two I am going to post here are comprehensive, have been well thought out over a long period of time, and the magic of it is that it has never been tried before...and THAT is precisely why it will work.
Freeper blueyon, (the originator of RINO FREE AMERICA PROJECT on FaceBook,) and I have worked on the idea to have each state message board create individual STATE BY STATE threads on the forum which presents information ONLY about their national congressional candidates.
We need their candidates’ names, pictures, platforms, voting records, (if applicable,) backgrounds, opinions, newslinks, statements, and whatever other information might be available including links to candidate’s’ websites if they exist.
The state message boards are full of much of this information and no one knows local politics like the locals. It’s time to make local politics national, and here is where we do it. Fifty states, fifty threads, ALL politics will be Free Republic Local politics.
Freepers have the best researchers in the business. We need that right here, right now if we are going to burn down the RINO tent and do it effectively. They will NOT be allowed to silence us again.
Those threads will be information only. Conservative candidates will be flagged and RINOs will be tagged. Anyone who wishes to debate or discuss individual candidates can start a separate thread for that here, AND/OR on the RINO FREE discussion board on FaceBook as well.
I expect these threads to become lengthy, so be sure to add the state and candidate's name as keywords.
The SECOND part of this plan is a NATIONAL strategy for accomplishing our goal once we have singled out the candidates we choose to support and gather THOSE candidates on to ONE thread. It is our intent to coordinate efforts with the National Tea Party Movement and have them link to our information as well as share whatever info they might have that we don’t...although I find that next to impossible knowing Freepers. There just might be tidbits of inside information we might not have access to, so contributions from outside Freeperdom will be researched by us FOR us and we will do well not to post rumor or inuendo if we have no proof.
The National Action plan is the sole hard work of a longtime Freeper who has asked to remain anonymous. It is his work and since he first sent it to me, he has updated it several times for the better. I neither take, nor deserve, any credit for it whatsover, and only on that basis did I accept the invitation to present it as I saw fit.
I have opted to make only the smallest changes to his ideas as they seem to me to be the stepstones of the future. However he did specifically ask that any constructive criticisms or additional ideas be sought and wants it known that this is a foundation we can build on. He has added reasons, including some from Scripture, for these ideas which are included in the body of information presented below. Many of you will find them relevant. Those who don’t will still find the ideas themselves worth your time. I am awed by the effort put forth here which is why I have left it pretty much in tact with minimal edits. I think you will be as well.
With that said, and without further adieu, continue on and see what ideas suit you best.
I find it fascinating that you continue to argue scripture and doctrine to oppose my political position yet mesta has not cried foul and cried out against YOUR hijacking of this political thread and arguing stuff that should be better discussed in the religion forum.
Interesting. But not surprising. Only certain religious positions appear to be prohibited on this thread. Namely mine.
>Context says that Peter and John were addressing the
>Jewish Sanhedrin for proclaiming salvation in Jesus while
>preaching on the temple grounds. The limit of the
>Sanhedrin’s authority was the Temple and its grounds.
Then explain all the following in context:
1) Romand 13:1 “Let every soul be subject unto the higher powers. For there is no power but of God: the powers that be are ordained of God.”
2) Acts 4:19 “But Peter and John answered and said unto them, Whether it be right in the sight of God to hearken unto you more than unto God, judge ye.”
3) Acts 5:29 “Then Peter and the [other] apostles answered and said, We ought to obey God rather than men.”
3) Exodus 1:17 “But the midwives feared God, and did not as the king of Egypt commanded them, but saved the men children alive.”
4) Exodus 2:2 “And the woman conceived, and bare a son: and when she saw him that he [was a] goodly [child], she hid him three months.”
4) Shadrach, Meshach, Abednego, and Daniel disobeying the government and refusing to worship other gods
5) Jesus saying “Render therefore unto Caesar the things which are Caesar’s; and unto God the things that are God’s” in Matthew 22:21
So ...
1) Jesus says obey both God and Caesar
2) God rewarded the Midwives for disobeying Pharoah
3) The book of Daniel exists as a testament to God’s law ruling over men
4) The Apostles put all the above in context: God first, man 2nd
5) Even the 10 commandments start with those we owe God, THEN to what we owe men
Clearly, once you throw Matthew 22:21, Exodus, and Daniel into the mix, we obey God first, and obey Man’s laws second.
>In fact, later, while in Corinth Gallio, the Roman
>Deputy, ruled that Paul’s preaching was not a
>concern of Rome and that was one of the reasons
>for Peter’s and Paul’s admonition to pray for
>those in power and obey the rulers.
You make it sound as if mere circumstance guided the
writing of the Bible. If you doubt the total divinity
of the Bible, please visit
http://www.direct.ca/trinity/y3nf.html for the details.
Given you and P-Marlowe have opposed neutering and expelling Islam througout this thread, for the following reasons:
1) in the name of “freedom” despite Islam’s obvious sedition and treason per posts 76 and 77, both completely unanswered
2) the Bible is seditious also, so hypocrites only want to expel Islam
3) You said in post 133, “Notice the statements were not qualified. There is no exeption for “evil” governments, withinn the sphere of their appointed powers,” despite 1-5 above. So, what does that have to do with your vehement opposition to the possibility of a grassroots effort to expel and neuter Islam?
1) Romand 13:1 “Let every soul be subject unto the higher powers. For there is no power but of God: the powers that be are ordained of God.”
I explained this already. Rome had not prohibited the preaching of the gospel and in fact the roman Deputy Gallio had given a decree making it legal so both Paul and Peter asked for prayers and obedience to the government in order to maintain the favorable policy.
2) Acts 4:19 “But Peter and John answered and said unto them, Whether it be right in the sight of God to hearken unto you more than unto God, judge ye.”
3) Acts 5:29 “Then Peter and the [other] apostles answered and said, We ought to obey God rather than men.”
This has been explained. Peter and John were addressing the Sanhedrin, not the government of Rome.
5) Jesus saying “Render therefore unto Caesar the things which are Caesar’s; and unto God the things that are God’s” in Matthew 22:21” “Clearly, once you throw Matthew 22:21,”
That's not the context of the passage nor what Jesus is saying.
‘Bring me a denarius,’ said Jesus; ‘let me see it.’ The denarius was a Roman silver coin; Roman taxes had to be paid in Roman coinage. Jesus asked, ‘Whose face is this? Whose name is this?’ The answer was ‘Caesar’s’. Jesus said the coin which bears Caesar’s face and name is obviously Caesar’s coin; let Caesar have it back. The verb translated ‘render’ has the sense of giving back to someone that which belongs to him. Caesar’s coins were best used for paying Caesar’s tribute. If that was what Caesar wanted, let him have it; the claims of God were not transgressed by such use of Caesar’s money. What was really important was to discover what God’s claims were, and see to it that they were met. Jesus laid primary emphasis on seeking God’s kingdom and righteousness.
3) Exodus 1:17 “But the midwives feared God, and did not as the king of Egypt commanded them, but saved the men children alive.”
4) Exodus 2:2 “And the woman conceived, and bare a son: and when she saw him that he [was a] goodly [child], she hid him three months.”
4) Shadrach, Meshach, Abednego, and Daniel disobeying the government and refusing to worship other gods
I'm not aware of any similar obligation in Old Testament times. The Exodus cites were before Israel was a nation and had any regulations as a nation.
Shadrach, Meshach, Abednego, and Daniel were willing to pay the price for disobedience.
“You make it sound as if mere circumstance guided the
writing of the Bible.”
You really need to study the history and context of scripture to see how God “works all things for good.... according to His prupose.” He uses here a Roman Deputy's animus towards whining Jews to open the doors to the Roman colonies for the gospel.
“You said in post 133, “Notice the statements were not qualified. There is no exeption for “evil” governments, withinn the sphere of their appointed powers,” despite 1-5 above. So, what does that have to do with your vehement opposition to the possibility of a grassroots effort to expel and neuter Islam?”
I'm sorry I don't know how to answer this non sequitur. I do know this though, the gospel will prevail over all religions, ideologies and philosophies of man and all nations, including Islamic ones will bow before the Lord Jesus Christ.
“grassroots effort to expel and neuter Islam?”
The only grassroots that can accomplish this is grounded in (2 Cor. 10:3-5)"For though we walk in the flesh, we do not war after the flesh: For the weapons of our warfare are not carnal, but mighty through God to the pulling down of strong holds; Casting down imaginations, and every high thing that exalteth itself against the knowledge of God, and bringing into captivity every thought to the obedience of Christ" and the Great Commission, “go and make disciples...!”
You know, I find it stunning that you insist on citing scripture to accomodate evil. So let us go back, as you suggested, to the days BEFORE Israel became a state, because for you to insinuate that Israel was NOT a nation in the eyes of GOD is a misnomer.
Israel was Jacob. Jacob’s offspring was Israel and became known as Hebrews long before the Exodus. So let us fast forward to Exodus. GOD ordered the Hebrews into battle with Amalek. GOD was with the Hebrews and as long as Moses’ arms were raised, the Hebrews won the day, but when Moses became tired and dropped his arms, the battle went the other way. If you do not see the lesson in that, then your knowledge of the Bible is lacking. As much as you can quote New Testament Scripture, you seem to not understand where that scripture originated from or why.
When GOD ordered the Hebrews into battle, it was not for a government, it was purely to fight the evil that was Amalek, the offspring of Ishmael. Moses was told to keep his arms raised. When Moses gave in to human frailty and lowered his arms after being commanded NOT to do so; when he cared more about his own aches and pains than GOD’s command, the Hebrews paid the price in blood.
Moses understood this and never again dropped his arms even if they had to be held up by aides until the war was won. He could neither eat, nor sleep, nor rest until the war was over.
THAT is the commitment GOD demanded of us then, and it is the same commitment demanded of us today. You do NOT drop your guard when confronting evil, lest evil win.
When the Hebrews decided they wanted a human king, GOD was ticked because it was human weakness, a decision AGAINST INDIVIDUAL FREEDOM, and lack of faith that brought them to that decision. HE gave them a king. That king was ALSO ordered by GOD to fight evil and wipe it off the face of the earth, but Saul disobeyed. Like you, out of misplaced compassion for the enemy, he “adjusted” GOD’s own command and disobeyed. For this, Saul was made mad, and evil continued to thrive.
GOD said He was at war with Amalek FOR ALL TIME and for the Hebrews to NEVER forget, but Hebrews disobeyed and left some alive and so it multiplied and we have been at war with Amalek ever since.
Solomon lost a kingdom for allowing Amalek to live and thrive within their midst because everything Amalek did corrupted and defiled the values Israel was supposed to adhere to. With the passage of time, Amalek never learned, never assimilated, never changed, but they changed those with whom they interacted. There is NO coexistence with evil.
That is what we find ourselves doing today. We are attempting the impossible. We are attempting to coexist with abject evil and it cannot be done. You cannot coexist with someone or thing that has NO desire whatsover to coexist with you on any level, but seeks to overwhelm you and all that is good in the world.
GOD does NOT adjust to humanity. It was a standing order that HUMANITY rid ITSELF of evil. We have not done that and until we do, there will be war.
It doesn’t matter what scripture you quote or what context you give it, all things flow from that ONE command which we have never obeyed.
So stop with the rationalizing and handwringing over saving evil in the name of LIBERTY. It flies in the face of both BIBLICAL truth and common sense. Giving someone permission to murder you is anathema since GOD itself is liberty.
We have had this choice for thousands of years and have chosen wrongly. And there is war.
BTW, have you watched today’s news? The muslims are rioting because they do not want Christians or others to use the Name of Allah, whom they praise as the ONE god, because it might confuse them into believing that we have the SAME GOD. Isn’t that just special?
Because I was taught that I AM is the ONE GOD. GOD never, ever named itself. Men gave GOD a name, but GOD is nameless and formless and the Laws that GOD gave are timeless.
OBEY the Law. Do not change it for the convenience of tolerating evil because evil will overwhelm you and you will become part of it.
You see this but you do not understand it. You willingly allow evil to exist in your midst. You capitulate, and each time you do this, you imperil your own soul and you drag the world with you.
I will not capitulate to evil. If LIBERTY means anything, THAT is what it means because evil is a master, and man cannot serve TWO masters.
http://www.facebook.com/home.php?ref=home#/group.php?v=app_2373072738&gid=194479048644
This is a link to the State Discussion boards on the RINO FREE AMERIA PROJECT on facebook.
While some have seen fit to attempt to quash this thread, the project continues.
I will be redoing this thread and reposting it after the weekend. I am angry and disappointed that TWO people have managed to turn this into a religion only thread. We worked so hard to try and present something worthwhile here. This was not a forum to preach the gospel. I had hoped this would not happen, and I had thought that we could bypass the religious infighting that even the mere mention of religion seems to engender among so many.
I tried to make it clear in the introduction to this thread that this is a time to unite despite the differences in our religions because most of us have common values and love of country that should surpass the claims that one form of any religion is better than any other, or that “my religion trumps your religion” infighting could not be set aside for even a day to do something to right what is wrong in this country. I do not consider the POLITIC of islam to be a religion that falls into this catagory, but I will not fight that war here anymore.
This is about taking our country back from the left and RINO elites that have systematically colluded to take our rights away, the SAME rights these two naysayers have attempted to use here to silence us, but could never get away with under a leftist or muslim regime. In THIS, they have presented the paradox and added fuel and impetus to the demise of free speech.
It would seem that some people here have decided that leaving the left in power is secondary to trying to destroy this project before it ever gets off the ground. I see this as rather skewed, but nonetheless, that is what it has come down to.
After trying to stop it, the belligerence became worse. I consider this thread has been hijacked, but I am determined not to stop here.
I KNOW when Jim approved this project, he did not expect this to happen and we, who dedicated many hours and days and some of us more than that, to pull together a draft proposal where we asked for ideas and constructive criticism, have not quit. We are regrouping, going to start again, and as I promised Nan, it will be crisp, clean, and simple.
We just can not afford to keep losing precious time being preached to. That is for pulpits, not politics. I did not start this thread to rehash the Bible. I don’t need lessons in Scripture. I need action to stop the left from making it impossible to do EITHER if it has its way.
What these two naysayers have done is throw monkey wrenches, not ideas. I have not complained to Jim nor the mods.
These guys have had their say and it is time to move on. I would hope that Freepers would get past this and on to the importance of the coming elections and what WE can DO to stop the damage to this country from becoming irreversible.
PLEASE help us do this.
Hey MM, joined.
Thank you for re-routing this thread Mesta...
BTW Brown seems to be neck and neck and the money’s coming in!
Oh Man!!! Thank you!
Never quit and never give in.
Some of that money is mine. I am watching everything. Just because I haven’t posted about it doesn’t mean I am not there. I have been working so hard on this project that I have done very little posting anywhere else.
The Brown race is important. Too important for me to ignore.
Thanks for the encouragement. It helps alot.
Hey! Just reported Browns moved up one above and broke the tie!...........I know your busy, and your work is much appreciated by all...and as important as Browns race, just so you know.
Copied and saved...very cool!...no need to post back.
People I want to back up what MestaMachine is saying that this thread is about taking OUR country back....anything out side of that, go start another thread!
We have an election coming up where we can vote, we can call and/or write those that hold office, we MUST take action. Do not splinter this goal by bringing in other stuff as I DO NOT CARE ABOUT THAT. I AM STAYING ON THE BIG PICTURE and ask that you also do the same.
We need names of candidates that represent less government - follow the constitution views. Post names and info and links here (and feel free to join facebook). Every one needs to be able to quickly see those running in their area to make their voting choices.
MestaMachine, THANK YOU for all your hard work. We will pull together. You and Jim are giving us the tools to build from and I for one really appreciate it!
Again, if we are splintered, we lose so STOP IT, together we can TAKE OUR COUNTRY BACK!!!!!
Islam is a form of government that is in direct opposition to the Constitution. They will use it to subvert the Constitution. They will start small....like a woman HAS to wear her burka on a DL photo. They will use the Constitution against us by using the very cry of religious freedom that you are espousing. And it's a lie. Islam is a theocratic government that will strangle the Constitution. Think about it.
And YOU miss the ultimate point. Even if Islam were a "form of government" that does not give THE GOVERNMENT the right to outlaw it or to otherwise squelch the members of the religion to peacefully practice their religion within the bounds of existing criminal and civil laws that apply to all religions, including those that the majority of American believe to be in opposition to the principles of the Constitution or even demonic in nature.
I personally believe that Islam is Satanic and potentially dangerous from many fronts. Nevertheless, Islam is considered a valid religion and it is practiced by nearly 1/3 of the inhabitants of the planet (a eerily similar number to the percentage of fallen angels who followed Satan).
That, of course is my opinion and to be quite frank, I am suspicious of the motives of Muslims because of what I believe to be the doctrines of demons that they espouse.
That being said, I firmly believe that while I believe that Islam is a dangerous cult, I also believe that as long as they are not breaking any existing criminal or civil laws and believe those doctrines of demons without trouncing upon my rights as a Christian or an American, then they have a right to believe all that nonsense in peace and THE GOVERNMENT has no right to tell them otherwise or to shut down their houses of worship or to prevent them from building more or even (God forbid) from proselytizing weak and deceived members of the Christian faith.
The First Amendement is a guarantee of our unalienable right to freedom of Religion and Freedom of Speech and Freedom of Assembly. The proposals on this thread to effectively outlaw the rights of Muslims to practice their religion, to speak freely about their beliefs and the assemble together at a place of their own choosing is, in fact, as UNAMERICAN as the beliefs that the Muslims have that they should someday overturn the Constitution and Install Sharia Law.
It is not Unconsitutional to hold to the belief that the Constitution ought to be eliminated and replaced by some other form of government. There are a number of Amendments to the Constitution that I believe go against the principles of our founders and I certainly would like to see them overturned, specifically the 16th and 17th Amendments, and I am sure that a lot of us have come to regret the passage of the 19th Amendment :-)
So if my religion preaches that Income Tax should be abolished and replaced by some other form of taxation, should the Govenment then have the right to come along and close down my church and declare my religion to be subversive and to prevent me for declaring my doctrine from the pulpits or to deny me and my fellow religionists the right to peacefully assemble or to work to change the Constitution to meet our idea of Utopia?????
Well that is what is being proposed on this thread. And what is being proposed is as UNAMERICAN as the doctrines of the religion that these people want to effectively outlaw in this country through the use of GOVERNMENT.
So we should all be opposed to Islam and we should all actively be working to convince people of the errors of Islam and trying to convert them to Christianity. However, if we all believe in the founding principles of the great nation, then NONE OF US should be asking the Government to close down mosques or to deny Muslims freedoms of religion, speech, and assembly because if we allow the GOVERNMENT to do that to the Muslims, you can be certain that someday that same Government will use that power against us. (Note that Canada is closing down Christian churches that preach against homosexuality. Do you think that can't happen here, especially if you are so anxious to surrender that power to the US Government to close down mosques????)
That, my FRiend, is the point. We should not be espousing the replacement of a Liberal Tyranny with a Conservative Tyranny, but instead we should be working to undo the power structure which allows tyranny of any kind to grow and prosper in the great nation.
We can do that through the power of Christ without resorting to leaning upon the arm of flesh and convincing our Government to violate the religious liberties of those we either religiously or politically oppose.
I will end with a parting verse of scripture:
Ephesisans 6:12 For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.
Don't trust the Government to fight your spiritual battles. That same Government can be used as a weapon against you. Trust in Christ. Preach the Gospel. Have Faith in God and do not put your trust in the Arm of Flesh.
Blessings,
Marlowe
Concisely and bluntly stated; thank you. You are absolutely correct in everything you said. I highly recommend everyone go back and re-read their history books to find out what happens when people can’t come together to fight a “common” enemy. While these people are arguing religious issues, the enemy is taking away “ALL” freedom and “ALL” religions. Your beliefs won’t matter when the traitors in office ration or deny you care and send you off to “their” hospice centers to die! Evil is surrounding you; one and all. Re-read history to see what evil does to people who are busy fighting amongst themselves. Evil takes over! You don’t have to go much further back than 1933-1934 Nazi Germany to see what evil is and how evil destroys you.
We have a common enemy at this very moment. Put your personal issues aside for the common good; that is, the survival of this country and your freedom. Your children and grandchildren will become “slaves” to the State if you don’t.
I believe that no new mosques should be built. I believe that some of them need to be watched closely. I believe that organizations like Cair need to be disbanded as they are enemies of our government.
This is a war between Ismael and Issac. See it for what it is.
BFLR
Your first statement and your last statement are contradictory. That being said, who do you want fighting your religious battles, the Government of the United States (you know, the one currently being run by Nancy Pelosi, Harry Reid and Barack Obama) or GOD?
I'll put my trust in God. You can put your trust in the Government. But remember the Government that can take away a Muslim's right to believe and worship according to the dictates of his conscience can just as easily take away the rights of a Christian to do the same.
In fact while you are clamoring to give the government MORE power to regulate our lives, they are doing just that. In Canada the GOVERNMENT is prosecuting preachers who preach against homosexuality and in England they are because they refuse to allow women to be priests.
They don't have a first amendment to protect these religions. We do, but some here think it is expedient to throw the first amendment out the window in order to stop some real or imagined spiritual threat.
I think we are stupid if we think we can use the power of government to control someone else's religion and think that that power will not be someday brought to bear against ours.
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